LUB & HYD OILS ARE THE MOST OILS LEAKED THROUGH OUR ALUMINUM HOT ROLLING MILL EMULSION.

IS THERE ANY TEST CAN CONDUCTED TO ANALYSE THOSE TWO OIL TYPES AND TELL WETHER THE CONTAMINANT IS HYD OR LUB OIL?
I RELY ON VISCOSITY TEST AFTER OIL EXTRACTION.HOWEVER THIS TEST CANNOT BE DEPENDABLE EACH TIME.

I'M TAKING 2 LITER SAMPLE FROM OUR MAIN TANK 200,000 Li CAPACITY

WOULD ANY ONE HELP ME ABOUT IT?
THANKS
CHEMIST

Garmco.

If the oil has separated from the Rolling Mill emulsion, you can run a spectrographical (RDE/ICP) analysis on it. Also run the same test on both other oils (lube and hyd) and compare the additive contents (Zink+Phosphorus+Calsium++). Most likely the lube oil contains some addives not present in the hydraulic oil.

How about if there is no ICP device?

I was trying to do calibartion curve of each hyd oil and lub oil in the extracted oil of % oil lub or hyd Vs viscosity?
I tried it before but there were no straight line given? is there any reason for that?

You will not be able to determine tramp oil content just from viscosity. Yes, the viscosity of the rolling oil will change due to tramp oil but also from oxidation, evaporation and changes in additive content. ICP is the simplest and probably the most accurate in terms of monitoring additives such as zinc, phosphorous, calcium, etc.
You could also try a gum residue test using a fresh oil sample as a reference and adding known quantities of tramp oils. The fixed size sample is evaporated and the remaining residue weighed. Increasing residue over the reference is a measure of tramp oils. However, the type of hydraulic/bearing oil in use can strongly affect the test (eg use of low stain oils for rolling applications)
Without ICP, you will not be able to determine whether the oil is hydraulic, bearing or gear oil. However, at the end of the day, if you can simply detect the tramp oil, monitor the trend and take action to reduce levels when necessary, you will help to improve the rolling oil life and performance.

THANKS FOR YOUR REPLY,
DO YOU KNOW WHICH ASTM STD TEST IS THIS( GUM RESIDUE TEST)?

DOESE ASH LEVEL TELL ME SOMETHING ABOUT THIS SORT OF OILS? OR ITS ALSO A SORT OF TREND

Gum test is determined accoroding to ISO 6246.
Ash test is according to ISO 6245. The ash is formed from the presence of metal compounds such as aluminium soaps but other contaminants (eg zinc from hydraulic oils) will also contribute. The ash test is essentially a trend which will help to indicate the effectiveness of any filtration or an increase in contamination.

Another possibillity is FT-IR analysis. If you get a lab to run ft-ir on each oil (lube, hyd and main oil) and put the curves on top of each other (layers). It might work.

Thank you for every one helped me with his/her useful information.

I do have FTIR with BF2 cell.
when I run my analysis there is no much difference between the comparative spectra ,
( all are oils)
How about if I increase the cell path length would it help me for my quantitative analysis?

Chemist,

From my experiences with 4 Hi reversible Steel cold rolling mill, I see your predicament a bit differently.

In a typical rolling mill the rolling oil and the maintenence oils like Hydraulic oil, bearing oils and grease all get mixed and end up at the DOT (Dirty Oil tank.) The trick is to to seperate them.

My recommendation is simple, add fresh water, agitate and allow to settle for a short time. Skim the top and remove the non-emulsifiable mixture of aluminum debris, grease and hydraulic and bearing oil. This skimmed amount may be less than 5% of the total and is not fit use in any form, as it would be containing metallic debris detrimental for any lubrication application.

What remains now, will be the rolling oil emulsion, which you can send back for rolling. Please test the emulsion concentration, pH etc., and adjust concentrations appropriately. This would account for 90 to 95% of the contents of DOT. At the bottom of the tank free water may possibly remain. This can be simply drawn off.

At the lab level you can simulate this by using a measuring cylinder in lieu of the DOT.

Hussam Adeni