According to this site http://www.silkoleneoil.com/techtip4.htm , and Castrols MSDS, it is a synthietic oil. Did I read this wrong and synthetic hydrocarbons are not synthetic?

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Originally posted by Jason8691:
According to this site http://www.silkoleneoil.com/techtip4.htm , and Castrols MSDS, it is a synthietic oil. Did I read this wrong and synthetic hydrocarbons are not synthetic?

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but the waters have been muddied by a court case that took place in the USA a few years ago

Not a court case. More info HERE

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the PAOs act as solvents for the multigrade polymers and a large assortment of special compounds that act as dispersants, detergents, anti-wear and anti-oxidant agents, and foam suppressants.

It is my understanding that this is wrong. PAO has very little solvent ability and the esters or GRP I are used for additive solubility.

Two major things wrong with that page.

So the Silkolene oil company is wrong in their definition of what PAO is?

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Originally posted by Jason8691:
So the Silkolene oil company is wrong in their definition of what PAO is?

Not with what it is, but what it does. Everything that I have read (including posts by lube engineers) indicates that Grp III and IV oils have very poor solubility (and are non-polar). Esters usually have very good solubility and are polar.

They got the court case part wrong, why not something else?

True, but it still doesnt change the fact that synthetic hydrocarbons means that the oil really is synthetic.

Do you have a link to the MSDS that you are refering to? I'm not sure of the point you are trying to make.

http://safetydatasheets.bp.com/ussds/amersdsf.nsf/0/736...0023539000220003.pdf
http://safetydatasheets.bp.com/ussds/amersdsf.nsf/0/25D...0023537000220003.pdf

The top one is for the Syntec, the bottom is the Blend. The GTX, and High Mileage say the same as the Blend. My point is that everyone keeps saying the Syntec is GP III, when the MSDS says synthetic. Even on the other site Castrol is bashed for this, and according to the MSDS, everyone is wrong about it.

Look up the CAS #s provided. The ones that start with 68 are GrpIV, the ones that start with 64 are petroleum based (GrpII or lower I would guess). The 92 is Grp III.

"may contain one or more of the following" is important wording.

Really? This gives me a headache! Oh well, I guess if the small writing changes the definition then I stand corrected.

To anyone that is interested syntec is in fact a group III motor oil and has been since 1997. Prior to that they were a full Group IV pao which they purchased from mobil oil.

In 1999 mobil sued castrol for false advertising. I use the term sued even though it was not a legal court case as we know it, but rather was heard in front of the NAD. National advertising division. They determined that group III oils were refined enough to be advertised as synthetic. The rest is history.

That said, it is important to point out that the German made castrol syntec is full PAO. This is because german laws do not recognize group III as true synthetics. This is the oil that comes in the BMW's and meets their specs. Next time you pick up american syntec read the specs on the back. You will find they don't meet many of the european specs especially the long life specs.

As of today it is difficult to find pure synthetics such as Group IV and V oils and is limited to some smaller companies with the noted exception of the German Castrol syntec which is difficult to find. Even mobil1 one has only small amounts of PAO the rest is group III. I guess they felt if you can't beat them join them.

If you want a pure group IV or better motor oil there is redline and amsoil. For street use Amsoil is probably a better bet. All there oils are PAO based exept their XL line which they openly tell you is group III.

Hope this helps.

All that is needed is for those companies which are still using PAO to educate the public. To boldly proclaim their PAO content and let people know if it doesn't say PAO, likely it is Group III. Why wouldn't the company using the better base oil, proclaim that fact? Only reason I can think of is they may not do it in case pricing gets to where they too want back down to Group III. If I want any PAO I will go to Amsoil because, as stated above, they do tell you which of their oils are PAO.