Magnesium in Oil

You can not predict the performance of an oil by looking at magnesia and calcium levels in it.

It's like saying "this picture has that much blue color and that much green - this one must be better then the other one"

Hi, I'm aware that you can't judge an oil by a virgin analysis. However, you can by used oil analysis. My point was, the industry lately has been using high amounts of Ca in place of Mg. Why is Amsoil one of the very few to still use 500 ppm or more of Mg in their oils? Cost cutting?

Old formulation technolgy.

It is my understanding that magnesium costs much less the the newer overbased calcium .

Detergents have been long known to help create combustion chamber deposits thus the absense of it in real racing oils .

Watch as everyone moves towards boron and less magnesium now and in the future . Mobil has lead the way in that respect since the advent of their Supersyn synthetic that came out in 2001 .

One thing seems obvious , large amounts of magnesium does little to prevent oxidative thickening

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One thing seems obvious , large amounts of magnesium does little to prevent oxidative thickening

No joke. Amsoil's #1 issue is oxidative thickening. It's really bad IMO for what you are paying for it. Aparently the new MC oils are using "ground breaking" additive technology. We'll see. Could be just Moly which has been used for quite sometime.

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Magnesium in Oil

We found that crystals form when engine oil containing magnesium-based detergents comes into contact with both mositure and acid at operating temperatures. Is this the kind of stuff you are talking about?

Timer, shoot me a msg?

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Originally posted by Buster:


No joke. Amsoil's #1 issue is oxidative thickening. It's really bad IMO for what you are paying for it. Aparently the new MC oils are using "ground breaking" additive technology. We'll see. Could be just Moly which has been used for quite sometime.

On topic of the moly Amsoil is now using , for years I have heard they have said moly is a no-no in any oil formula and thats why they don't " did not " use it but lookee now

MoDTC is a good anti-oxident . Maybe now if one wants to use a 40wt for 5k miles they won't need to buy a 30 wt initially

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Hey MB.

I agree, Amsoil has done their fair share of trash talking the additive, which is now used by virtually every oil on the market in some quantity.

Amsoil will have new oils shortly that will be completely based off their new Motorcycle oils. The ASL/ATM/TSO 30wt oils will all be thinner, around 10.6cSt but remain A3 rated. I'm guessing they will be using XOM/ChevronTex new low volatile PAO's. I hope this proclaimed "ground breaking" additive technology is more then the little bit of Moly they are now using. If not, I'll have to really start wondering about how cutting edge Amsoil really is.

Should help their oils remain in grade better.....

Sirs,
I am sure that you know about problems with exhaust valves of DDC Engines Series 149. These valves are fail quickly if the motor oil has Sulphated Ash more than 0.8 wt.%. But how you know the Detergent Performance of Motor Oil is in direct proportion to sulphated ash. We want have MO with high level detergent, but we must have limit on sulphated ash.
Some years ago Chevron solves this problem.
“Chevron started marketing RPM Motor Oil at 0.83% sulfated ash. Its low sulfated ash, combined with its unique balance of magnesium and calcium detergent, can eliminate valve failure. This oil contains a maximum of 500 ppm of calcium detergent, in addition to ZnDTP”. (citation from Preventing Catastrophic Valve Failures In Detroit Diesel 149 Engines With Chevron RPM Motor Oil by J. A. Mc Geehan, W. Alexander, P. R. Ryason, and B. L. Schmidt). “This formulation provides a unique valve seat deposit. Magnesium containing components of the valve seat deposit are unstable, decompose, and do not remain on the valve seat. Thus, the valve seat deposit is thinner with this specific magnesium--calcium detergent oil. A thinner deposit on the seat results in a lower valve seat temperature because there is less insulation between the valve seat and the cylinder head. As previously described, the thinner deposit prevents localized loss and channeling of the deposit, and subsequent valve failure.”
I think that after Chevron other Oil Manufacturer use Mg + Ca detergents for its Motor Oils.

Regards,