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Read our primer articles on High Mileage Oil, Synthetic Oil and Kinematic Viscosity

This drama-queen cat fight isn't even remotely interesting anymore and I'm not sure if it was ever informative.

Use a fighting-grade oil & change every 3 months or use a high-quality syn (no PIB, no GrpIII, no plasticizer) and extend your drain based on hard data of some sort, or fall somewhere in between. It may all come down to how you drive your vehicle. Maybe there's not a one-size-fits-all solution? Maybe the path you choose is all a matter of personal and/or lifestyle preference and doesn't really say much about your moral or intellectual character?

Maybe any of those approaches, taken thoroughly & responsibly, will allow your engine to outlast the rest of your chassis?

Henry Ford used to send engineers to the junkyards buy & tear apart old Fords to see which parts were still in good shape. Then FoMoCo would design a less robust version for the next iteration. He didn't see the point of throwing quality away. I don't get the obsession with making sure the engine is pristine when the rest of the rusting hulk is towed to the junkyard.

If this is the most important thing you guys have to argue about, I'd trade problems with any of you straight up.
It is not the place of the courts to declare a product garbage, The marketplace determined Yugos are garbage a decade ago or so.

I think this is what he meant to say: "Now send me ONE FACT that can in court of law prove beyond any doubt that YUGO is not a GARBAGE !!!


Synth oil is overkill for many apps. No reason to use it if your engine is not spec'd for it.

Good dino/synth oil, along with a reasonable OCI, along with the use of a good filter, and routine maintainenece, goes a long way towards sludge prevention. And a good engine design doesn't hurt either.

Isn't the oil's fault if you run extended drains. Or if you run the wrong viscosity. Or an obsolete spec.

Isn't the oil's fault if you don't fix those leaking head/intake maniflod gaskets. Or never check your PCV.

It isn't the oil's fault if you fail to check the dipstick.

It's the fault of the cheap nut who owns it.
Last edited by trajan
Seems at leat 3 of us agree using a qt of oil in 6K miles is no big deal, a qt in 4000 miles would be no big deal either. Try taking a new car in for warranty work and tell the service writer you used a qt of oil in 4000 miles and see what he tells you. They will do nothing unless they see an oil leak.

Imgaine what a Yugo dealer would have said back in the day? LOL

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quote:
Originally posted by Deltona_Dave:
All engines use oil, just some more than others.

Around the year 1963 I got out of racing, sold my ride. I needed a cheap ride so bought a 1930 something Chev, had running boards, suicide doors, stick coming right out of the tranny, and a back seat that was like a sofa. Can't remember the year, but it cost me $50. Every Saturday I would drive to Yonge St. and Lawrence Ave. in Toronto to a gas station that sold bulk oil out of large steel drums for .90 per gallon. I went through a gallon of 30 weight oil every week.
quote:
Originally posted by ADFD1:
Kirk, I suggest you back off Lamont, he knows a lot more than you do. He has no agenda, and he's respected here. he's not considered a joke like you and your teacher are.

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Nothing against Lamont.

However,he is against anything better than status-quo for the typical "Grocery getter"-as he calls it!

I,on the other hand, have never settled for status quo,especially when there is something much better,and the norm has failed many motorists based on the facts,and history!!!
Shop cars, train station cars, grocery getters, or old beaters I always felt should get maintained but there is no point spending top $ on oil. Save the big $ oil for the best cars of the fleet. Besides in most applications the entire car will rot and fall apart long before the engine fails, unless the engine is a poor design or specifically calls for synthetic oil. This has been proven time and time again. Most car buffs spend more than they have to for oil and filters. Proper maint, and proper intervals for changing oil is the key to long engine life.

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quote:
Originally posted by ADFD1:
Shop cars, train station cars, grocery getters, or old beaters I always felt should get maintained but there is no point spending top $ on oil. Save the big $ oil for the best cars of the fleet. Besides in most applications the entire car will rot and fall apart long before the engine fails, unless the engine is a poor design or specifically calls for synthetic oil. This has been proven time and time again. Most car buffs spend more than they have to for oil and filters. Proper maint, and proper intervals for changing oil is the key to long engine life.

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It has been proven time and time and ......... time, again.

But due to the reasons pointed out by BLK above, it just does not register with some.

All this nonsense that conventional oil is bad, or causes sludge, is just that, nonsense.

Cars still come factory filled with it. Oil companies still make it. Millions of cars still run on it.

Using synth oil along with 3-5k oil changes or when your engine doesn't call for it is like using 93oct in an engine that calls for 87.

Certainly using synth in a Yugo is throwing money away.
quote:
Originally posted by Trajan:

It has been proven time and time and ......... time, again.

But due to the reasons pointed out by BLK above, it just does not register with some.

All this nonsense that conventional oil is bad, or causes sludge, is just that, nonsense.

Cars still come factory filled with it. Oil companies still make it. Millions of cars still run on it.

Using synth oil along with 3-5k oil changes or when your engine doesn't call for it is like using 93oct in an engine that calls for 87.

Certainly using synth in a Yugo is throwing money away.


I agree and time and time again my father and uncle have proven it to me. Synthetic oil has its place but it is not for everyone. Especially in the beater class of cars.

I'd like to add to your comment about using synthetic oil in a Yugo is throwing away money. Using anything in a Yugo including gas was throwing away money. Simply buying one was a waste of cash. There were cars in the day with 100,000 miles or more on them that were still better than a new Yugo. My dad told me a funny story about a test drive he did in one of them. Garbage/Junk was a compliment!

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Current mineral engine oil formulations are hardly 'status quo' compared to those of decades past. Additive & base oil technology are constantly improving. Used properly, minerals will serve a great majority of automotive applications effectively.

Synthetics have their place, but that place is primarily in industrial formulations, which is where the real severe service applications live. I have a real hard time envisioning a unit that typically operates maybe 4-5 hours out of 24 as 'severe service', the psychology of marketing notwithstanding.

Sorry if I hurt the feelings of any latent adolescents when I call their dream supercars 'grocery-getters', but that's the reality. Severity of service is about actual service, not engineering. You're most likely running to the Wawa more often than you are running in the Paris to Dakar road rally.
walah........after 15pages should we discuss this 4life again?.......
enoch

QUOTE]Originally posted by Captain Kirk:
quote:
Originally posted by ADFD1:
Kirk, I suggest you back off Lamont, he knows a lot more than you do. He has no agenda, and he's respected here. he's not considered a joke like you and your teacher are.

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Nothing against Lamont.

However,he is against anything better than status-quo for the typical "Grocery getter"-as he calls it!

I,on the other hand, have never settled for status quo,especially when there is something much better,and the norm has failed many motorists based on the facts,and history!!![/QUOTE]
LS-9 - Syn Because it is my pet CPA CFOs and she wants it that way

Hemi - Syn, Because I want it that way to make me feel better about my extended drain intervals. In this case, it pays.

'Glide. Syn in the crankcaase because it is air cooled and hot. Needs it. The other 2 reservoirs, mineral or semi syn gear lube. Good for 5,000 miles crank and 20,000 in primary and tranny.

Kids cars. -Good mineral. They need the life experience of keeping up with it.

Lawn crap, are you kidding me!.....

But, bottom line, Lamont is right. They're grocery getters except for that few weeks a year when my truck goes to the beach and lives in 4 WD full time.
Last edited by robertc
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