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Synlube

A adfd1Member
quote:
Originally posted by Captain Kirk:
quote:
Originally posted by ADFD1:
Miro...............Trajen bashing Synlube, no. I look at him as a public servant looking for truth, so people don't get caught up in your little scam. Up to this point you haven't shown any proof, NOTHING. Take the con game somewhere else, this board isn't buying, and they are growing tired of your nonsense and lies.

AD


AFD1....the only person busted for fabricating lies is trajen.


AFD1....would you please post something that makes sense and is relevant!!

Trajen is no public servant by the way......... He is a public nuisance!!.......I am the one on this forum who is the public servant because of my JOB AND WHERE I WORK THANK YOU VERY MUCH!!! Yes....I actually have a JOB!!!

I never said that big oil was sued in court for sludge. I stated major issues with sludge and class action lawsuits. Big oil is a GIANT CARTEL(OPEC) with deep pockets half running the world and has the best lawyers and the most powerful legal dream team in the world!!

The engine sludge is what is relevant!!

Would someone accept the challenge of why all those cars with sludge all had store bought name brand oil.

NO sludge in any of those cars with either synlube...or amsoil. I just gave a plug to amsoil if you haven't noticed.

The issue at hand is why I use synlube. The name brand oils on the shelves has not held up well in modern day high tech engines...the sludge and emission issues proves that.

The EPA,and government in general is putting tremendous pressure on the automaker to build cleaner running cars,better emission systems,better fuel economy ect. Why not big oil as well?

The motor oil in stores is not keeping up with automotive technology...that has always been the case!!

The fuel at the pumps is also an issue. Just look at all the money spent on fuel injection services and bottles of fuel system cleaner on the shelves. It's a billion dollar business!!

Only some service stations offer top tier gas which also has some issues and needs a boost of techron or shell v-power at times. I use shell. All the other top tier gas has left my state...why? My VW 1.8T has major driveability and starting issues with all the other gasoline...ONLY VERY SLIGHT ISSUES WITH TOP TIER FUEL. One bottle of cleaner solves all my issues for a while. Low quality fuel is a major issue as is low grade motor oil typically purchased in stores or installed from bulk oil at your favorite repair shop!!....The very same shop with the engine flush machine for sludge,and the very expensive fuel injection service you pay plenty over and over. I think some of you must have a love affair with big oil!! To hedge my bet,I have invested in some oil stocks!!

Poor fuel and motor oil is a proven issue that you can't deny if you're head is not in the sand!!


Kirk everything I've posted makes sense. How's this, post some facts for us, OK? Until then expect the bashing from the members to continue.

AD
T trajanMember
The can't post what they don't have ADFD1, thus why they make issuse where none exsist. Such as my profile, not using a real name like kirk claims he does, miro's claim that I work for Shell, or the claims I lost some 2.3 mil in a non exsistant commission from a company I never worked for? Or being abandoned by a non exsistant wife.

Rich fantasy life they have if nothing else.

And ole inhal. Well, as you aksed him pages ago when he complained about us asking these questions "So a car enthusiast asking some questions that all oil companies will answer is wrong." Well, it must be, as he still has a problem with it.

Don't know why they're making me the focus of such spew. I'm not here selling a product.

And we might want to ask: https://forums.noria.com/eve/fo...=511104214#511104214

Why hasn't kirk answered Robert C's request?

To wit:

Show me verifiably independent test reports and visual documentation from an inspection of sludge prone engine running synlube.

VOA, UOA, and dealers warranty paperwork will be a start.
Last edited by trajan
I inhaliburtonMember
quote:
They can't let the facts be known on the scam they are trying to pull off.The conclusion on another forum was they are doctoring up used oil and rebottling it. One person in a thread stated they received their oil in used bottles???


Ya, I read that on BOBALOO. Total nonsense. You guys keep parotting scam, scam, scam. What scam? These people are USERS. They don't care about test tube tests, VOA, UOA, or any of the endless demands you mud slingers have been whining for the past 6 years. They don't care. They are very happy with the results they are getting from using the product just as I'm happily using Amsoil products in my car and commercial equipment. I would never waste money on such tests. The stuff works. I'm happy. After 50 pages, its obvious that you guys are incapable of getting it. It's typical of people who think inside the box.

Thanks for dropping by...
C captainkirkMember
quote:
Originally posted by snakedoctor:
Yeah, I guess ignorance is bliss.


Ignorance is truly bliss.....when your ignoring trajen and his clone snakedoctor at the same time!!

TRAJEN.......You sir....have issues!! What is your problem??

As I have stated before....I am using the product.....I am not a science lab. My engines are the science labs that speak for themselves by running on synlube and remaining in perfect condition!!
T trajanMember
quote:
Originally posted by Captain Kirk:
quote:
Originally posted by snakedoctor:
Yeah, I guess ignorance is bliss.


Ignorance is truly bliss.....when your ignoring trajen and his clone snakedoctor at the same time!!

TRAJEN.......You sir....have issues!! What is your problem??

As I have stated before....I am using the product.....I am not a science lab. My engines are the science labs that speak for themselves by running on synlube and remaining in perfect condition!!


Show me verifiably independent test reports and visual documentation from an inspection of sludge prone engine running synlube.

VOA, UOA, and dealers warranty paperwork will be a start.

Remember that from Robert C? You fail to comply.

This is me being surprised.....
C captainkirkMember
quote:
Originally posted by ADFD1:
quote:
Originally posted by Captain Kirk:
quote:
Originally posted by ADFD1:
Miro...............Trajen bashing Synlube, no. I look at him as a public servant looking for truth, so people don't get caught up in your little scam. Up to this point you haven't shown any proof, NOTHING. Take the con game somewhere else, this board isn't buying, and they are growing tired of your nonsense and lies.

AD


AFD1....the only person busted for fabricating lies is trajen.


AFD1....would you please post something that makes sense and is relevant!!

Trajen is no public servant by the way......... He is a public nuisance!!.......I am the one on this forum who is the public servant because of my JOB AND WHERE I WORK THANK YOU VERY MUCH!!! Yes....I actually have a JOB!!!

I never said that big oil was sued in court for sludge. I stated major issues with sludge and class action lawsuits. Big oil is a GIANT CARTEL(OPEC) with deep pockets half running the world and has the best lawyers and the most powerful legal dream team in the world!!

The engine sludge is what is relevant!!

Would someone accept the challenge of why all those cars with sludge all had store bought name brand oil.

NO sludge in any of those cars with either synlube...or amsoil. I just gave a plug to amsoil if you haven't noticed.

The issue at hand is why I use synlube. The name brand oils on the shelves has not held up well in modern day high tech engines...the sludge and emission issues proves that.

The EPA,and government in general is putting tremendous pressure on the automaker to build cleaner running cars,better emission systems,better fuel economy ect. Why not big oil as well?

The motor oil in stores is not keeping up with automotive technology...that has always been the case!!

The fuel at the pumps is also an issue. Just look at all the money spent on fuel injection services and bottles of fuel system cleaner on the shelves. It's a billion dollar business!!

Only some service stations offer top tier gas which also has some issues and needs a boost of techron or shell v-power at times. I use shell. All the other top tier gas has left my state...why? My VW 1.8T has major driveability and starting issues with all the other gasoline...ONLY VERY SLIGHT ISSUES WITH TOP TIER FUEL. One bottle of cleaner solves all my issues for a while. Low quality fuel is a major issue as is low grade motor oil typically purchased in stores or installed from bulk oil at your favorite repair shop!!....The very same shop with the engine flush machine for sludge,and the very expensive fuel injection service you pay plenty over and over. I think some of you must have a love affair with big oil!! To hedge my bet,I have invested in some oil stocks!!

Poor fuel and motor oil is a proven issue that you can't deny if you're head is not in the sand!!


Kirk everything I've posted makes sense. How's this, post some facts for us, OK? Until then expect the bashing from the members to continue.

AD


AFD1....Thanks for admitting that the members are the ones doing the bashing. What facts would you like? Try it yourself like I did!!!

Here is how you do it.....The way I did it!!! If you dare!!!!


Install synlube in your MECHANICALLY SOUND/EMISSION SOUND//CLEAN engine if you have the guts! I did! Still do! ANY PREEXISTING ISSUES IF ANY WITH YOUR ENGINE NEEDS TO BE ADDRESSED FIRST!!! That should go without saying!!!!

Monitor the dipstick,...breather filter/pcv/valve where it applies and often to prove it to yourself there will be no issues!! I never found any!!!

Remove oil fill cap and look for sludge or issues weekly if in doubt!!! I found none...ever!!

Change first oil filter at 3k-5k and cut open for inspection(synlube will desludge your engine if you have preexisting sludge(that's a good thing). Filter should have what synlube cleaned up in your engine from previous oil......that's a good thing too!!

It's an amazing flush to clean your engine!!!!

(((Too much preexisting sludge should be addressed first by a professional!!!!!)))) Otherwise don't bother putting synlube in an engine that already has issues. It's too late!!!


Change second filter at 10k or less if you are "scared" and cut it open once again to inspect!! Mine always looks very clean after the first filter!!

Always start engine and listen for any abnormal noises. I never have any!!

Check your fuel milage...emissions etc. Compare with before synlube and after. I had great results there as well!!! I never fail emissions...I live in NJ...they inspect in NJ!!!!

I did all those things over the years up to 65,000 and 6 years in at least two cars and never had any issues ever....and then I traded them in for new cars that now have synlube. STill have the vw,the lawnmower,etc with synlube. No issues!!! Great running engines only!!!

If you can't handle doing the above steps.........why are you still here discussing synlube??? You....in the end will have to try it and prove to yourself.

Remember..... I am not a science lab.....the EPA..ETC.ETC....I am a customer!!!!!!!!!

If your are still "chicken",...but want more proof....then come check out my vehicles. Would you like me to post some pics of my cars,etc with the dipstick in the photos. What do you want from me??? Budman already has done that at BOB'S PLACE. How much more proof!!!! Go hound budman!! At least he put up photos!!! You also have proof over there as well!!


Have you notice how long this has been going on now? Decades. The forums go back almost 10 years. Nothing has changed...same product,company,etc.etc. How much more proof do you need before you try someting?? This is way beyond ridiculous!!!
Last edited by captainkirk
A adfd1Member
So that's how you prove it Kirk. You tried it and that is proof. You are the Almighty Oil Guru Kirok, you and your alter ego Miro. Your words are all any of us need. Plus $32/qt and a magical filter, and some magnets. Oh and if I lived in NV we could meet in an alley for the transaction.

Dream on Kirkie Boy............I still ain't believing......In fact you can continue your rant, and dig your way to China. Keep on diggin.....

AD
I inhaliburtonMember
Posted by: GUESS WHO?
quote:
Show me verifiably independent test reports and visual documentation from an inspection of sludge prone engine running synlube.VOA, UOA, and dealers warranty paperwork will be a start.Remember that from Robert C? You fail to comply.This is me being surprised.....


Same old, same old. blah blah glah. Gimme Gimme. Ad nauseam. You deserve NOTHING.
I inhaliburtonMember
From ADFD1
quote:
So that's how you prove it Kirk. You tried it and that is proof. You are the Almighty Oil Guru Kirok, you and your alter ego Miro. Your words are all any of us need. Plus $32/qt and a magical filter, and some magnets. Oh and if I lived in NV we could meet in an alley for the transaction. Dream on Kirkie Boy............I still ain't believing......In fact you can continue your rant, and dig your way to China. Keep on diggin.....

You still don't get it. He's saying that he's happy with the product. Therefore, he's saying no need for a VOA, VOC, ABC, XYZ or MDSABC high school test tube test, or Bunsen burner test. No need for junk science. Get it now? I doubt it...
T trajanMember
quote:
Originally posted by vitual_mage:
Inhaliburton, you complaining as much ,acting like a teenager to and seems to have as much free time then everyone else.So before , posting your own opinion and your mighty judgment,realize at the end of the day you acting the same.


It just galls the boy that we don't take synlube cultists' word.

Haven't seen the links that show thsoe test result yet.
I inhaliburtonMember
Another one of Trajan's meaningless blurbs:
quote:
It just galls the boy that we don't take synlube cultists' word.Haven't seen the links that show thsoe test result yet.


Nobody cares what you negateers think. The guys of similar ilk to yourself contribute nothing. The stuff works as advertised as many users have indicated, and you guys have nothing that indicates that it does not perform as advertised. Show us all the seized-up engines. Show everyone the sludge buckets. There must be dozens, hundreds, thousands because the stuff doesn't work, right? The only thing you guys can produce are satisfied users. That's what burns you up.

Nor do you have any test results that you can bad mouth. Life's tough for you naysayer types. All you can do is whine for test results that you are never going to see. You keep saying that the stuff is no good. Show us your proof.

You want test results? Buy the stuff yourself and pay for your own testing, cheap guy.
E enochcaMember
Yes we are waiting your document as you said your product passed the test and i think you (Mr. Miro) knows all member in this forum waiting this document.
thanks,
enoch

quote:
Originally posted by Trajan:
Not interested in cars that, as you say, are past their useful life.

So, where are the documents to the tests that synlube crows they passed?

You claim to pass them. Let's see them. No links to a suspect site.
C captainkirkMember
quote:
Originally posted by Miro Kefurt:
Since 51 pages of arguments are not enough yet here is link to the about 2 more that will magincally clone to 60...

https://forums.noria.com/eve/fo...4995/m/190100014/p/2


Notice how all the negative naysayers fell silent with regard to all the issues with engine sludge using their beloved name brand oil.

Apparently...I must have asked too many hard core questions dealing with the facts!!!

You know what they say...........the truth hurts!!!
Last edited by captainkirk
C captainkirkMember
quote:
Originally posted by snakedoctor:
How does a 5W50 get to be API SM ILSAC GF4. More false advertising??
There is no label on the back.

I guess they ran out of new Mobil 1 bottles, oh thats right they use used bottles, to put their doctored used oil in.

prove you don't or loose by default.



Trajen/Snakedoctor......Looks to me like you have already purchased the Synlube oil... nice picture. How many bottles did you purchase and what cars did you install the lube in.
T trajanMember
quote:
Originally posted by Captain Kirk:
quote:
Originally posted by snakedoctor:
How does a 5W50 get to be API SM ILSAC GF4. More false advertising??
There is no label on the back.

I guess they ran out of new Mobil 1 bottles, oh thats right they use used bottles, to put their doctored used oil in.

prove you don't or loose by default.



Trajen/Snakedoctor......Looks to me like you have already purchased the Synlube oil... nice picture. How many bottles did you purchase and what cars did you install the lube in.


Wrong again boy: http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/...umber=1846428&page=9

Or are you going to accuse me of being TaterandNoodles as well?
M mirokefurtMember
quote:
snakedoctor


OK Mr. Brent Olsen, it is amazing how nice you are on phone ordering SynLube for your lawn mover!

But of course you are free to do with the Oil what ever you wish.

Still however I seriously doubt that you have any understanding of Motor Oil Tests, such as engine tests that take from 40 to 500 hours, which of course is no problem for SynLube that lasts many times longer in service.

Chemical composition except for "free" phosporus is not any part of any performance specification or API or ILSAC "grading".

I really doubt that you will invest into ASTM D4951 to verify any $20 quickie test that has no colleration that was ever proven by anybody.

If such low cost tests were of any special value then they would be in use by the industry and not sold to amateurs with promisse of secret knowledge.

Or even ASTM D4951 would probably cost you more than the "lawn mover".

On the phone both in a message and talking to me personally you claimed that you could tell difference in the engine operation - to the better - was that a LIE ?

Just curious about how dishonest you really are !!!



Just in case you do not know it for your lawn mover there is only this procedure:

Small spark-ignition engines are regulated by 40 CFR Part 90, "Control of Emissions from Nonroad Spark-Ignition Engines at or below 19 kW." You should be able to get the certification data from the OEM and/or EPA and then just compare the Emissions with SynLube, the "useful life" is right there on the EPA tag, so you can prove to yourself very easily how much longer the lawn mover will last with SynLube and NO oil changes.

Since you have not purchased enough SynLube to fill up 1993 FORD V8 and 1996 General Motors Powertrain 3800 Series II - then you really can not do ILSAC GF-4 or API SM test...

Syn-cerely

Miro Kefurt
Last edited by mirokefurt
M mirokefurtMember
Anyone who really needs to know can buy API 1509 and then you will understand what gets disclosed and to whom and when and under what conditions, that is if you are not too cheap to spend $127.00 on 8 years out of date document:

This publication describes the API Engine Oil Licensing and Certification System (EOLCS), a voluntary licensing and certification program designed to define, certify, and monitor engine oil performance deemed necessary for satisfactory equipment life and performance by vehicle and engine manufacturers. Engine oil marketers that meet EOLCS requirements may be licensed to display two Marks, the API Service Symbol and the API Certification Mark.

Sections 2 through 6 of this publication define the current API engine oil service categories and explain the EOLCS licensing requirements, the API Marks and their use, and the EOLCS Aftermarket Audit Program. Appendices A through Q provide a brief history of engine oil classifications, describe methods for developing new engine oil performance requirements, and explain the interaction and roles of the vari- ous independent organizations that are part of the API EOLCS.

API 1509 - Complete Document
Revision / Edition: 15 Chg: Date: 04/00/02
ENGINE OIL LICENSING AND CERTIFICATION SYSTEM

Comments: FIFTEENTH EDITION * C150915 * ORDER BINDER AT N/C
Superseding Document:
Page Count: 72
In Stock: Yes
Hardcopy Price: $ 127.00

First of all neither ILSAC or API tests any "licensed" products, they only SELL you the "license" to use the two marks on the BACK LABEL. Out of over 5,000 "licensed" motor oils only few hundred at most get "tested" and even under that program 10 to 15% of the oils examined DO NOT meet the specifications on the lables - and the OFFENDING BIG OIL COMPANIES are not disclosed by API !!!

So the "monitoring" system for which a small compnay like ours has to pay $63,000 to $66,000 annually can not even be used to demonstrate that BIG OIL is selling "crap" - API protects their identity !!!

System where the FOX is guarding the chickens, and the chickens pay for the privilege of being eaten by the other Foxes - really reliable and just system !!!

Since 98% of motoring public and over 80% of fleet managers have no idea what API ratings are it is not cost effective to spend over $63,000 annually to have "license" to display two marks on BACK LABEL.

Our customers simply do not care and prefer to save the avereage $1.00 per Liter.

Also our fleet customers prefer to return the empty bottles for re-fill and thus save another $2.00 per liter in the process.

New customers always get NEW bottles, unless they request the re-used bottles.

Some of the bottles make 26 to 32 round trips before they get rejected due to aging of the plastic, that is lot of "trash" that does not end up in land fills - almost 18,000 to 20,000 bottles annually.

When we say we are environmentally correct Company we really mean it.

On the other hand if you wish to spend $90 extra for 24 Carat Gold plated can that has certified storage life of 25 years, we have that as well - and guess who buys it that way with your tax money !!!

And no the $90 can can not be reused as you have to puncture it to open it, again Government efficiency at work - are you not glad to know where your tax money goes ?
Last edited by mirokefurt
I inhaliburtonMember
quote:
Originally posted by snakedoctor:
How does a 5W50 get to be API SM ILSAC GF4. More false advertising??
There is no label on the back.

I guess they ran out of new Mobil 1 bottles, oh thats right they use used bottles, to put their doctored used oil in.

prove you don't or loose by default.



Hey Trojan/Snakedoctor,

Congrats. You saw the light. Now, after you drive 50 to 100 k miles, do the tests you and the other negateers have been whining for the past 6 years, and let us all know the results, okay? No cheating now, you rascal(s)!!!!!
C captainkirkMember
quote:
Originally posted by Trajan:
where are the documents to the tests that synlube crows they passed?

You claim to pass them. Let's see them. No links to a suspect site.




Trajen....I noticed you spend more time discussing Synlube then anyone else on these boards based on all your posts on Noria and Bobs' place. Why?? You have the record on that one and it's growing...............and you have never even tried or used the product. Bravo!!!! You must really hate Synlube on some personal level......it shows big time!!!!!!!!!!

I also noticed you spent more time then even I did doing all the sludge research online.....wow....that was great!!!!

Remember when I first mentioned the issue of sludge you denied it totally....I remember and so do the posts that still exists when you denied the issue. Your denial sure has changed based on all your posts relating to the research you did on sludge and then posting it to boot. You did a nice job of proving me correct on that topic and acknowledging the issue.

So far Trajen......you keep proving me to be correct. Do you even realize that???

We are now wondering how you can state that the entire world is now producing defective engines. That's a good one!!!

Is your claim based on the fact that the class action lawsuits and the respective lawyers have determined it is easier to sue a car maker vs Big Oil. That's always a lawyers strategy....to sue the easiest target....not necessarily the guiltiest....ask any lawyer.....that's a no- brainer!!!

You act like the car maker was the one who blended the oil that went into the engines....that would be a different story.

The bottom line.....the mass scale sludge ONLY occurs with retail bulk oil....... period!!!!! That is all the proof anyone would ever need.....that's all I ever needed!!
D deltonadaveMember
I am not taking any sides here, but Capt. Kirk, you are so fond of "bulk oil sludge", why don't you ask the large OTR trucking fleets to use your "synlube". These trucks do 150K a year! If that truck is down for maintenance, the company/driver is losing money. If there was a product that could save them downtime, they would be jumping all over it. Truth is, Heavy Duty diesel engines are designed for abuse, long OCI's and minimum downtime. The mechanics are going to use the cheapest "bulk" oil and service them at the longest interval.

If this synlube was worth a hoot, there would be many links, besides the frontpage 98 with the "dashboard" theme, that looks amateurish.

Miro needs to take his meds, I don't think the Gov't would want oil in a gold plated can. They go for the low bid. I know, I work in government. Low bid wins.

I hear crickets....
Dave
D deltonadaveMember
quote:
Originally posted by Trajan:
Kirk fails to understand that the class action suits had nothing to do with oil, but the engines.

He still can't show what we want.


Trajan, I am not taking sides, just looking for "truth", outside of suspect site. If I wanted to buy this junk, I would need to see documented proof. If it was so good, I would see references on Cummins, Cat, DDC, Volvo, etc.
but, nope. just suspect site (as you like to call it).

Dave
C captainkirkMember
quote:
Originally posted by Trajan:
Kirk fails to understand that the class action suits had nothing to do with oil, but the engines.

He still can't show what we want.


Trajen.....I want you to tell everyone on this forum that the world is now making defective engines,.....not DEFECTIVE oil.....go ahead and say that!!! YOU CAN'T YOU WON'T YOU KNOW IT!!
C captainkirkMember
quote:
Originally posted by Deltona_Dave:
I am not taking any sides here, but Capt. Kirk, you are so fond of "bulk oil sludge", why don't you ask the large OTR trucking fleets to use your "synlube". These trucks do 150K a year! If that truck is down for maintenance, the company/driver is losing money. If there was a product that could save them downtime, they would be jumping all over it. Truth is, Heavy Duty diesel engines are designed for abuse, long OCI's and minimum downtime. The mechanics are going to use the cheapest "bulk" oil and service them at the longest interval.

If this synlube was worth a hoot, there would be many links, besides the frontpage 98 with the "dashboard" theme, that looks amateurish.

Miro needs to take his meds, I don't think the Gov't would want oil in a gold plated can. They go for the low bid. I know, I work in government. Low bid wins.

I hear crickets....
Dave



So what "cheapest oil" as you say are the wrench turning mechanics installing in these $100,000 plus trucks now days???
C captainkirkMember
quote:
Truth is, Heavy Duty diesel engines are designed for abuse,



Deltona...............Define abuse. Instead....allow me first then you next!!


Small,lightweight,high revving and overworked ,emission clogged/choked, and built to last about 150k with a very high horsepower/torque to weight ration!!

Short trips and incomplete warmups!

Stop and go! Excessive Idling!!

Four hundred pound lightweight relatively cheap CONSUMER grade engine pushing/pulling 5000 pounds or more.

ONE Tiny oil filer that hold 15 oz. of oil.

The biggest ABUSE of them aaalll..................installing store bought low grade bulk oil in the above engine and it's abuses and then wondering why all the sludge and other issues arose long before the typical life expectancy of 150,000 miles was reached.



I also would like to know what your point was comparing low cost/light weight car engines to very,very expensive heavy duty commercial/industrial diesel engines designed to last 10 times longer and use typically 15W-40 diesel oil with sumps that measure gallons,not quarts,and several king size industrial oil filters!!!!
C captainkirkMember
quote:
Originally posted by Trajan:
The class action suits were aimed at the engine makers, not the oil.

Show otherwise.

Where are the documents to the tests that synlube crows they passed?


I already explained why and how savvy lawyers aim their lawsuits. That is a mute point. If I were a lawyer I would go for the easy money and the easy win.

Big oil has too many lawyers and endless cash/power and you know that!!

Instead, explain why no sludge occurred when 100% PAO high tech oil was used. You keep avoiding that one!!!

That's the one that you keep avoiding...because it proves cheap oil causes sludge and you keep dancing around that question.
T trajanMember
quote:
Originally posted by Captain Kirk:
quote:
Originally posted by Trajan:
The class action suits were aimed at the engine makers, not the oil.

Show otherwise.

Where are the documents to the tests that synlube crows they passed?


I already explained why and how savvy lawyers aim their lawsuits. That is a mute point. If I were a lawyer I would go for the easy money and the easy win.

Big oil has too many lawyers and endless cash/power and you know that!!

.


You have not explained anything but a perception.

A false one at that.
D deltonadaveMember
quote:
Originally posted by Captain Kirk:
quote:
Originally posted by Deltona_Dave:
I am not taking any sides here, but Capt. Kirk, you are so fond of "bulk oil sludge", why don't you ask the large OTR trucking fleets to use your "synlube". These trucks do 150K a year! If that truck is down for maintenance, the company/driver is losing money. If there was a product that could save them downtime, they would be jumping all over it. Truth is, Heavy Duty diesel engines are designed for abuse, long OCI's and minimum downtime. The mechanics are going to use the cheapest "bulk" oil and service them at the longest interval.

If this synlube was worth a hoot, there would be many links, besides the frontpage 98 with the "dashboard" theme, that looks amateurish.

Miro needs to take his meds, I don't think the Gov't would want oil in a gold plated can. They go for the low bid. I know, I work in government. Low bid wins.

I hear crickets....
Dave



So what "cheapest oil" as you say are the wrench turning mechanics installing in these $100,000 plus trucks now days???


Cheap oil they use is usually Rotella-T, Delvac, or Delo. Stuff runs them less than 5 dollars a gallon bulk.

Dave
I inhaliburtonMember
quote:
Originally posted by Trajan:
Understood Deltona. At $32 a bottle, no one should buy this based on info that's been presented so far.

"I use it and it works" just doesn't cut it.

Trojan, you should qualify your statement by saying words to the effect, "In my opinion...." It's obvious to me that you are no expert in this field because Miro shoots you and others down every time you make one of your silly statements.

Also, your second statement should say that it "doesn't cut it for me." That would be fair. To imply that it doesn't work for "anyone" is not fair because you don't represent "everyone," only yourself. Synlube clearly "works" for those who are actually using the product and have achieved results as advertised.

There is a clear distinction between "users" and you. Users purchased said product and do not seem interested in "tests." They are satisfied with its performance. You, on the other hand, clearly will never use the product with or without a plethora of test data, no matter the results.
D deltonadaveMember
quote:
Originally posted by Captain Kirk:
quote:
Truth is, Heavy Duty diesel engines are designed for abuse,



Deltona...............Define abuse. Instead....allow me first then you next!!


Small,lightweight,high revving and overworked ,emission clogged/choked, and built to last about 150k with a very high horsepower/torque to weight ration!!

Short trips and incomplete warmups!

Stop and go! Excessive Idling!!

Four hundred pound lightweight relatively cheap CONSUMER grade engine pushing/pulling 5000 pounds or more.

ONE Tiny oil filer that hold 15 oz. of oil.

The biggest ABUSE of them aaalll..................installing store bought low grade bulk oil in the above engine and it's abuses and then wondering why all the sludge and other issues arose long before the typical life expectancy of 150,000 miles was reached.



I also would like to know what your point was comparing low cost/light weight car engines to very,very expensive heavy duty commercial/industrial diesel engines designed to last 10 times longer and use typically 15W-40 diesel oil with sumps that measure gallons,not quarts,and several king size industrial oil filters!!!!


Hmm, abuse. Diesel engines run usually 24/7 on OTR, unless the driver decides to do his 10 hours downtime in a hotel, or has an apu. These trucks haul 40 tons in all types of weather, and normally do not get their oil changed when they should. This is due to the FACT that when the truck is down for maintenance, it is losing money, so the companies push them to the limit to make more money. It is called Capitalism.

Hmm, I also work with a fleet of over 250 CVPI sheriff's vehicles. They average over 100K before it is time to go to auction. Let's see, they get cheap dealer mystery bulk oil (presumed to be Motorcraft) and a filter every 5K which is 2K over Ford's recommendation for severe duty.

No sludge anywhere. Engine is the same as any other 4.6 modular. Only has a bigger alternator and an extra transmission and power steering cooler over the civilian model, unless you by the crown vic with the towing package, that is the CVPI.
C captainkirkMember
quote:
Originally posted by ADFD1:
C Kirk- I think asking why diesel rigs don't use Synlube is a valid question. You mention how abusive small gas engines are on oil, good points. How about those $150,000 rigs that run sometimes 24/7, why aren't they buying Synlube and running it 150,000 miles?

AD


That might be a question you could ask Miro.

I know they take 10-15 gallons of oil and sometimes use a gallon/every 8k-10k when the oil is soot loaded.

How much oil these trucks burn/leak would be a good question someone on this forum can address.

What oil do they typically use,who decides,and why?

Why don't they all at least use Mobil Delvac1,Amsoil,Shaeffer's etc....let alone Synlube.
C captainkirkMember
Deltona Dave.....I fail to see what your point is with big rigs at this time nor how it addresses all the known sludge issues and lawsuits in the U.S. and Abroad.....police car engines have not been sludge prone and are typically very fully warmed up with plenty of oil changes..........then auctioned off at 100k for obvious reasons and replaced with our tax money over and over.

We are off topic with big rigs and cop cars.
D deltonadaveMember
Miro says he has diesel "synlube", but at that price, most fleets can get 6 gallons of Rotella for the price of 1 quart synlube. And most HD engine manufacturers allow rigs to go 25K or more on conventional.

Caterpillar even states in their lubrication guide that oil that "generically states meets or exceeds Caterpillar standards ECF1", is not to be used in their engines. They want either Cat oil or a Major brand with CH/CF-4 or higher. They even send out test kits to have oil analyzed by Cat. every 500 hours to see how well it is holding up.
D deltonadaveMember
quote:
Originally posted by Captain Kirk:
Deltona Dave.....I fail to see what your point is with big rigs at this time nor how it addresses all the known sludge issues and lawsuits in the U.S. and Abroad.....police car engines have not been sludge prone and are typically very fully warmed up with plenty of oil changes..........then auctioned off at 100k for obvious reasons and replaced with our tax money over and over.

We are off topic with big rigs and cop cars.


Nah, we are not off topic. I am just stating that sludge has more to do with engine design and not so much oil. A properly designed engine like a cop car or heavy duty truck engine will not sludge, even if using cheapo oil. My Nissan Titan will go 7500 miles on Dino and I don't fear that it will sludge, as most Nissan engines are not known sludgers.

The best thing anyone should do before buying a car is to do a little research before hand, follow the OM and maintenance schedules, and use quality lubes and accessories. Remember, you get what you pay for.

With that, I am signing out for the night. Have to be at work at 0400 hours.

Good night folks.

Dave
C captainkirkMember
quote:
Originally posted by Deltona_Dave:
Miro says he has diesel "synlube", but at that price, most fleets can get 6 gallons of Rotella for the price of 1 quart synlube. And most HD engine manufacturers allow rigs to go 25K or more on conventional.

Caterpillar even states in their lubrication guide that oil that "generically states meets or exceeds Caterpillar standards ECF1", is not to be used in their engines. They want either Cat oil or a Major brand with CH/CF-4 or higher. They even send out test kits to have oil analyzed by Cat. every 500 hours to see how well it is holding up.


You just most likely answered your own question. The guys running the fleets only look at the initial price of the oil and don't care about anything else....happens all over America with doing things on the "cheap" because it looks good up front and impresses your manager and gives you that "attaboy" pat on the back for saving money. I call that "penny wise and dollar foolish".

How many recalls,accidents,tragedies,infrastructure issues,etc. have happened because someone was cheap and cut corners!!
M mirokefurtMember
On the matter of "synthetic" HD Oils use in USA.

Actually other than SynLube, no one really makes 100% Synthetic NON PETROLUEM HD OIL.

Even companies like AMSOIL repackage the DELO oil into their own bottles, as they could never afford all the tests given the miniscule use of such oils in USA.

In pre "depression, economic downturn, or what ever you wish to call it" it was less than 1% of the HD vehicles in USA that used such oils.

Today it is 0.3% as even the few that did use them cut their expenses to minimum.

Mobil before Exxon takeover spend $20 to $24 million on promoting Synthetic HD Oil to fleets and did not succeed to convince them for 26 years to even try it.

Today really only DELO (Chevron) makes what they call "synthetic" but really it is also just glorified petroleum.

People like Trajen should have a field day with that one, they if pressed give you this definition of DELO Synthetic:

Chevron's proprietary ISOSYN technology combines highly refined base oils with advanced additives to create products that rival synthetic lubricants in critical performance tests.

No admission that anything actually is synthetic = man made = look up the definition, but that it "rivals" synthetic lubricants !

Delvac 1 SAE 5W-40 is de facto the ONLY HD Motor oil that depending on how Exxon feels that week contains 40% to 60% PAO and about 15% to 20% of premixed additive package (in SN 150 petroleum oil) and alkylated hydrocarbons (another almost synthetic code name for "petroleum").

It is the best there is and at price that is $30 to $35 by the gallon (not $5 as someone stated).

But still 4 times cheaper than SynLube to buy, but 2 times as expensive to use, since ExxonMobil will not take even "fresh oil" back once a distributor ends up stuck with it - which they ultimately do.

Anyway "fleet" managers do not seem to be able to use a calculator, much less a computerized spread sheet - nor they understand "preventive" maintenance.

Most fleets just do not have a clue, period.

Owner Operators are what is now called "living dead" and really can not afford to invest to "save" money.

Fleet managers are not the drivers.

And to be and HD driver all you need is to stay awake and sit - no thinking is required.

While our economy depends on truckers and I have high respect for the job they do, they are not appreciated, grossly underpaid and thus only people that even fail to get job with Government end up being truckers.

Sad but true. And if you even have bit of bran activity left, that sure goes away after the 24/7 CW music treatment.

So on the subject why don't they all use it ?

They just do not know they should, and they just do not have the intelectual ability to figure out the benefit of lubricant that costs them "nothing" to use, but which requires "investment" up front to derive that benefit.

Average HD tuck could save $700 per month in fuel costs alone and about another $250 in oil changes - but if you have no idea what is your FE to start with, such saving can not be demonstrated.

Michelin gave up on trying to sell "single" rear tires that can save as much as 15% on fuel and last about 25% longer but costed about 120% more than "single" tire - even the fact that ONE tire replaced TWO tires was apparently too much to comprehed for truckers and the management.

That in my opinion is a "no brainer" !!!
Last edited by mirokefurt
M mirokefurtMember
This is the MSDS definition of ISOSYN from which DELO Synthetic HD oil is made:

Highly refined mineral oil (C15 - C50) Mixture 60 - 100 %weight

FLAMMABLE PROPERTIES:
Flashpoint: (Cleveland Open Cup) <200 °C (<392 °F) Minimum

Magically when you highly refine (as compared to "conventional refining") any petroleum it turns into a "synthetic" - at triple or quadruple the Retail Price, it offers almost no measurable benefit over "Conventional HD Motor Oil" so no wonder it is not embraced by the Tucking Industry - just plain way to expensive to use.

I rest my case !!!

PS: SynLube will not even flash at 525 F

No need to pay $600 for ASTM test, just use your home owen, the "synthetic" any thing made from petroleum will catch on fire long before the SynLube will even boil - someting you can prove to yourself at home, but I would recommend you invest into ABC fire extinquisher, you will need it !!!

Just set your owen at 450 F (the limit on most owens) and "broil" !!!

Once you do that and see what will remain after that "test" you may never want to use your favorite Oil ever again.....
Last edited by mirokefurt
C captainkirkMember
quote:
The best thing anyone should do before buying a car is to do a little research before hand, follow the OM and maintenance schedules, and use quality lubes and accessories. Remember, you get what you pay for.


Do a little research??......explain all those Toyota owners with acceleration issues that was "hidden" from the public? So much for a "little" research!

Explain all the sludge issues with.............LEXUS,VW,AUDI,TOYOTA,DODGE,CHRYSLER. ALL BAD ENGINES....REALLY?

EXPLAIN ALL THE CLASS ACTION LAWSUITS.

Show why those engines sludged up when the owners manual was followed and documentation was provided in many of the cases to back this. Many of the cars were dealer serviced!!

Deltona.........you have been stating your own assertions,opinions,ignoring all the facts and giving your said personal observations involving a garage at your work place that you claim to be privy. I don't buy it!!

Are you going to have one believe that you also work overtime in a police garage fixing cop cars after your detective shifts ends?

Have you interviewed all the mechanics in your garage and compiled data to back your claims regarding the condition of all those cop car engines. If so...how would that relate to the much bigger picture of sludge across many car brands and class action lawsuits!!

You're an expert on big rig diesels as well?

Now you find the time to post here even with your very busy schedule of being a police officer,..detective,...cop car mechanic,...big rig expert,..oil guru,tribologist......and who knows what else. You're better then YODA!!

I only have stated the big picture facts and left my opinions out of the discussion.

Pointing out individual or small scale examples has little if any validity pertaining to major issues.
Last edited by captainkirk
C captainkirkMember
quote:
Mobil before Exxon takeover spend $20 to $24 million on promoting Synthetic HD Oil to fleets and did not succeed to convince them for 26 years to even try it.




I remember the mentality back then that synthetic oil in general was a scam or some kind of rip-off and not needed. Now it's installed at the factory!

Too bad it's not really true 100% synthetic oil,just typically the Cat.III synthetic.

Where are all those naysayers now? Perhaps they have morphed into synlube bashers!!! or Sludge deniers!! or Trajen/snakedoctor.
T trajanMember
quote:
Originally posted by Captain Kirk:



Explain all the sludge issues with.............LEXUS,VW,AUDI,TOYOTA,DODGE,CHRYSLER. ALL BAD ENGINES....REALLY?

EXPLAIN ALL THE CLASS ACTION LAWSUITS.



They were explained. Both here and in the suits. Bad design.

You still fail to show that those suits you love to bring up were aimed at the oil companies.

Blah blah, big oil blah blah big money blah blah. You can't even show that such suits against the oil companies were even filed, let alone dismissed.

Where are the docs to the tests synlube claims they passed.
E emMember
quote:
Originally posted by Deltona_Dave:
I am not taking any sides here, but Capt. Kirk, you are so fond of "bulk oil sludge", why don't you ask the large OTR trucking fleets to use your "synlube". These trucks do 150K a year! If that truck is down for maintenance, the company/driver is losing money. If there was a product that could save them downtime, they would be jumping all over it. Truth is, Heavy Duty diesel engines are designed for abuse, long OCI's and minimum downtime. The mechanics are going to use the cheapest "bulk" oil and service them at the longest interval.
Dave

- off topic -

We have actually developed a tool for this used by one of world's largest oilco's. It enables you to fill in the vehicle(s), labour time/hour rates, mileage, downtime, oil price, other service items like filters and calculates the savings or extra costs when using a high interval oil. More info on request.
D deltonadaveMember
quote:
Originally posted by Captain Kirk:
quote:
The best thing anyone should do before buying a car is to do a little research before hand, follow the OM and maintenance schedules, and use quality lubes and accessories. Remember, you get what you pay for.


Do a little research??......explain all those Toyota owners with acceleration issues that was "hidden" from the public? So much for a "little" research!

Explain all the sludge issues with.............LEXUS,VW,AUDI,TOYOTA,DODGE,CHRYSLER. ALL BAD ENGINES....REALLY?

EXPLAIN ALL THE CLASS ACTION LAWSUITS.

Show why those engines sludged up when the owners manual was followed and documentation was provided in many of the cases to back this. Many of the cars were dealer serviced!!

Deltona.........you have been stating your own assertions,opinions,ignoring all the facts and giving your said personal observations involving a garage at your work place that you claim to be privy. I don't buy it!!

Are you going to have one believe that you also work overtime in a police garage fixing cop cars after your detective shifts ends?

Have you interviewed all the mechanics in your garage and compiled data to back your claims regarding the condition of all those cop car engines. If so...how would that relate to the much bigger picture of sludge across many car brands and class action lawsuits!!

You're an expert on big rig diesels as well?

Now you find the time to post here even with your very busy schedule of being a police officer,..detective,...cop car mechanic,...big rig expert,..oil guru,tribologist......and who knows what else. You're better then YODA!!

I only have stated the big picture facts and left my opinions out of the discussion.

Pointing out individual or small scale examples has little if any validity pertaining to major issues.


I am a a retired police officer. I now work at a Sheriff's Office as a vehicle electronics specialist. I install and maintain the In Car cameras, Mobile Data terminals, citation printers, software, and other things. I am under the hood of the CVPI's a lot. I work with our Fleet Mechanics daily.

About Heavy Duty Diesels, A good friend of mine is an Independent Diesel and Auto Mechanic, I have been to his shop many times to observe and help out ( I like to turn a wrench).

I have not claimed anywhere to be an "expert" on oil sludge. I am just stating observations, and I research. I don't care about lawsuits and oil sludge. I service my vehicles on schedule and sleep well at night.
D deltonadaveMember
I did not come here to "bash" synlube or anyone else. If I wanted to use synlube, I would do so. But, I am like most others that want idependent verifiable proof that this lube works as advertised. Not just references to one website and a few testimonials. Until then, I will use my humble GrpIII synthetic and change every 5K. I take my old oil to the County recycle facility. Yes, I recycle my household stuff too. I am not a tree hugger, as I drive a full size truck. I even use the shredded tire mulch around the house. Stuff lasts for years!

Good Day.
I'll be 10-10 for a while.
Dave
D deltonadaveMember
Miro,
I never said Delvac-1 was 5 dollars a gallon bulk, I was referring to the Conventional oils. Rotella-T, Delo 400, and Delvac 1300. Delvac-1 retails for 55, so bulk would be about 45% of that or roughly 30-35 a gallon.

Also, there are a lot of OTR truck drivers that have College Degrees, especially the HazMat haulers. They choose to drive after retiring. Why not, they can travel the country, take in some sightseeing, and get paid (not much, but they can make a living.)

Again, I am not here to bash synlube, I am just trying to get some independent verifiable facts.

Maybe you could work out a deal with a regional trucking company? They could advertise the fact that your product works and they are saving $$$ and less downtime. Stuff like that will build up credibility. No, I am not a marketing "expert". Just a suggestion.

Dave
M mirokefurtMember
quote:
Deltona_Dave


Thanks for the suggestion, but actually Synthashield (a private brand of American Fine Lubricants) tried to market SynLube to fleets.

They lost $2.3 million doing it, they gave away samples (FREE) only to get feedback like "WOW that is great - can we get MORE FREE STUFF for rest of the fleet !"

My end of the business is to produce the product as I am one of the only 3 people alive than know how to make it - it is up to the other people to sell, market and promote it.

I can only clone myself so many times in a day, and actually daily do a work that would require at least 4 full time people if I hired someone to replace me to do all that I do do daily.

One big point is that people do not realize that our pricing has been the same since 1996 and we have even upped the container size from Quarts to Liters at no extra charge.

If SynLube was "Oil" and used any petroleum then of course our costs/prices would be lot more.

In 1985 it was $50 per US Quart.

In 1969 it was $200 per Liter (well $186.20 with discount)

If you ship an EMPTY box across US it costs $5.00 to $7.50

If you put one Liter of SynLube in it (ADD OIL) then it costs $6.00 to $10.00 and that is for $20 "worth" of SynLube.

Most of our business is sending daily boxes of one or two Liters of ADD OIL to our existing customers that on average use that much in about two years.

So when you consider that Delvac-1 as you say retails for $55 per gallon = $14.67 per liter

Than our SynLube ADD OIL with FREE SHIPPING is actually a cheaper alternative.

Now you add the fact that we BUY the USED Synlube back at 100% of what the cusomer paid for it ($32.00 per initial fill) and the use of SynLube is only 1/2 to 1/3 the cost of PETROLEUM.

ANYONE can change the SynLube as often as they wish, but again that does not seem to register - they only see the UP TO maximums of 10 years or 150,000 miles, but those extremes were ALWAYS only recommended for the EXTREME USES.

Like trucks or van that is on Interstate 90% of the time the 150,000 miles limit would apply.

Car that is seldom or never driven -like lot of collector cars - 10 years

For everyone else we have for 26 years recommended 5 years or 50,000 miles OIL CHANGE Interval - but again people seeem to fail to read the LARGE PRINT !!!

The referenced tests on our web actually explain which LONG TERM test were undertaked and why, and who did them and when.

http://lube4life.com/SynLubeLTT.htm

54 pages and tons of arguments but very few people take any time to actually read anything, or take time to "understand" what it says or claims.

But I have to thank you for taking time to clarify your position and not flying of the rocker when doing it.

If you know Cown Vic then you for sure can appreciate the AAA test on it.

http://www.synlube.com/press.htm

Or the "test" by OAKLAND CA Police Dpt on 6 Vics (all new) that was long term comparison on 15 2000MY all bought at the same time.

AFL = Synthashield spent a fortune on that installation even flown their own mechanic from Los Angeles to Oakland, only to be told 9 years later "can we get MORE FREE STUFF but this time for 35 cars !!"

They of course did nto bother to drain and return the SynLube with over 100,000 miles average on the "test" cars before they went to auction and they got on the averge $1,400 per car - each had $500 worht of SynLube in them

Motor Oil, PSF, ATF, Differential, and DOT 5.1 + Coolant.

It was too much trouble to "drain and return" FREE SynLube - but AFL paid us for it of course, as we do not giveout FREE stuff to anyone.

SO that is my scoop on that one....

http://lube4life.com/fleet.htm
D deltonadaveMember
Who is the contact at Oakland PD? I will drop them an email from my work (I work at a Sheriff's Office.)

Now I can see why you are not going with OTR. Your lube is only good for 50K under "extreme" conditions. Most modern OTR diesels will go 25-50K on conventional (if you are in doubt, check out the maint. intervals on Detroit Diesel site).

It would take 200+ dollars to fill my personal truck (32*7 quarts) to go 50K on your oil, not including filter, add oil, magnets, etc. My truck sees "extreme" duty, towing, idling, etc. I can use conventional oil for 5K for about the same amount during that 50K. Where is the benefit? I like spending time maintaining my vehicle. It only takes 30 minutes every 4 months.

FWIW,
Dave
D deltonadaveMember
A city as large as Oakland CA, those vehicles would see 100K in 2 years, if they were "hot seated aka pool cars." If they were issued "Indy Plan", they would see 100K in about 4 years. Our County is small, about 30miles long, 15 miles deep, and our Deputies put 30K a year average. We are retiring '06 now, but some '07 have already been auctioned, with an average of 100K. We get our monies worth out of them. After 100K, the front end will need a lot of repairs and are not cost effective, and definitely not safe at pursuit speeds.

dave
M mirokefurtMember
Okland City owns all the vehicles and as you can see the In City average MPH is in teens,
The Oil however was in the vehicles for 10,000 hours on the average.

They sit at intersections, by school zones, and do Park Ranger service, they do not chase people or patrol Highways, that is job for CHP.

Jerry Brown, then Mayor of Okland City was our contact through AFL.

PS: The only issue in your truck would be how much oil it burns, remember you get FREE SynLube in exchange for the USED Synlube ANYTIME YOU WISH.

The 5 years or 50,000 miles is the limit that our Insurance will underwrite, that is their decision not ours. And if you do that on a NEW vehicle the TOTAL Limit is 15 years from date of manufacture and 150,000 total odo miles.

On USED vehicle if you convert it before 60,000 miles or 5 years the Limited Lubrication Warranty is up to 10 years form date of MFG or 100,000 total miles.

Such Warranty if purchased separately would be about 2 to 3 times the cost of SynLube !!!

And it is FREE to anyone who sends back VIN, MFG Date and Date of Installation.

Most people with IN City driving average 22 to 27 MPH and over the road the average is 45 MPH.

The Engine Run time matters lot more than the indicated miles, both for engine wear and Lubricant Lifetime.

The Oakland City chagnes the oil on the patrol vehicles every MONTH, no matter what the miles, that is the only way they can keep track of which vehicle was serviced.

The cost of disposal of TEXACO oil in californai for the city was TWICE the cost of a drum of fresh petroleum - In CA they charge to remove used Oil from Fleets, some other palces in USA they actually pay you to get the used oil, so over all economy has to include the disposal costs, etc.
C captainkirkMember
quote:
Now I can see why you are not going with OTR. Your lube is only good for 50K under "extreme" conditions. Most modern OTR diesels will go 25-50K on conventional (if you are in doubt, check out the maint. intervals on Detroit Diesel site).


Dave Those trucks hold about 10-15 gallons of engine oil in the pan if I'm not mistaken. If those trucks are going 25-50k on conventional oil.....how far would they go using synlube is the question.

I think the milage intervals with cars vs. trucks would be relative to the what the manual recomends.

I will take an educated guess that Miro could verify... and figure the big rigs using 10-15 gallons of Diesel synlube engine oil and using a ratio of 3000 miles for cars vs the 50k you stated above for the OTR trucks...... or 16X longer than the stated 50k...... would be 800k using synlube???


Just a guess!!
C captainkirkMember
quote:
Originally posted by Trajan:
The documents to the tests that synlube crows they passed?

Why don't you show them.

No links to a suspect site. Verifiable proof.



I am not the one to show proof Trajen...remember.......I am the consumer!!!!!!!! However...Miro has been doing plenty more than adequate showing an array of proof such as...facts,figures,tests,EPA,fleet users, and so forth.

You have plenty more proof then you will ever need at this point to actually use or at least consider using the product.

Deltona_dave is willing to contact the Oakland police department regarding their experience with synlube in their fleet of police cars.

That shows to me he is at least considering using synlube, or very interested in synlube.......otherwise why would he bother doing all of that leg work!!!

Why are you still here for that matter?????
T trajanMember
When you claim that a product you sell passes tests, you have to do more than just claim it.

Claims are not enough. You should be able to provide the test results. Results that can be verified.

So far, nothing but smoke, mirrors, deflection, misdirection, insults.

More than likely, because said results are nothing more than a fabrication.
C captainkirkMember
quote:
Originally posted by inHaliburton:
quote:
I am not the one to show proof Trajen...remember.......I am the consumer!!!!!!!! However...Miro has been doing plenty more than adequate showing an array of proof such as...facts,figures,tests,EPA,fleet users, and so forth. You have plenty more proof then you will ever need at this point to actually use or at least consider using the product. Deltona_dave is willing to contact the Oakland police department regarding their experience with synlube in their fleet of police cars. That shows to me he is at least considering using synlube, or very interested in synlube.......otherwise why would he bother doing all of that leg work!!!Why are you still here for that matter?????

Hey, Capt. Kirk. Guess what's going to be in Dumb Dumb's next post?

Very interesting info in Miro's posts lately...


Let me take a guess regarding what's in his next post.................ummm.....something dumb again.!! Yep......something dumb!!!
D deltonadaveMember
quote:
Originally posted by Captain Kirk:
quote:
Originally posted by Trajan:
The documents to the tests that synlube crows they passed?

Why don't you show them.

No links to a suspect site. Verifiable proof.


I will get in touch with Oakland P.D. to obtain their opinion on the synlube. I am looking for a reputable opinion. I should be able to have a little confidence from their fleet manager/tech/ or even the Chief. I will do this Monday. I am on a few days leave to get some chores done around the house.

Off air until tomorrow.
G'day.
Dave

I am not the one to show proof Trajen...remember.......I am the consumer!!!!!!!! However...Miro has been doing plenty more than adequate showing an array of proof such as...facts,figures,tests,EPA,fleet users, and so forth.

You have plenty more proof then you will ever need at this point to actually use or at least consider using the product.

Deltona_dave is willing to contact the Oakland police department regarding their experience with synlube in their fleet of police cars.

That shows to me he is at least considering using synlube, or very interested in synlube.......otherwise why would he bother doing all of that leg work!!!

Why are you still here for that matter?????
T trajanMember
quote:
Originally posted by Captain Kirk:
quote:
Originally posted by inHaliburton:
quote:
I am not the one to show proof Trajen...remember.......I am the consumer!!!!!!!! However...Miro has been doing plenty more than adequate showing an array of proof such as...facts,figures,tests,EPA,fleet users, and so forth. You have plenty more proof then you will ever need at this point to actually use or at least consider using the product. Deltona_dave is willing to contact the Oakland police department regarding their experience with synlube in their fleet of police cars. That shows to me he is at least considering using synlube, or very interested in synlube.......otherwise why would he bother doing all of that leg work!!!Why are you still here for that matter?????

Hey, Capt. Kirk. Guess what's going to be in Dumb Dumb's next post?

Very interesting info in Miro's posts lately...


Let me take a guess regarding what's in his next post.................ummm.....something dumb again.!! Yep......something dumb!!!


Another definition of irony.

And a typical synlube response from both kirk an inhal. Talk about kindergarten.....
C captainkirkMember
quote:
Originally posted by Miro Kefurt:
Okland City owns all the vehicles and as you can see the In City average MPH is in teens,
The Oil however was in the vehicles for 10,000 hours on the average.

They sit at intersections, by school zones, and do Park Ranger service, they do not chase people or patrol Highways, that is job for CHP.

Jerry Brown, then Mayor of Okland City was our contact through AFL.

PS: The only issue in your truck would be how much oil it burns, remember you get FREE SynLube in exchange for the USED Synlube ANYTIME YOU WISH.

The 5 years or 50,000 miles is the limit that our Insurance will underwrite, that is their decision not ours. And if you do that on a NEW vehicle the TOTAL Limit is 15 years from date of manufacture and 150,000 total odo miles.

On USED vehicle if you convert it before 60,000 miles or 5 years the Limited Lubrication Warranty is up to 10 years form date of MFG or 100,000 total miles.

Such Warranty if purchased separately would be about 2 to 3 times the cost of SynLube !!!

And it is FREE to anyone who sends back VIN, MFG Date and Date of Installation.

Most people with IN City driving average 22 to 27 MPH and over the road the average is 45 MPH.

The Engine Run time matters lot more than the indicated miles, both for engine wear and Lubricant Lifetime.

The Oakland City chagnes the oil on the patrol vehicles every MONTH, no matter what the miles, that is the only way they can keep track of which vehicle was serviced.

The cost of disposal of TEXACO oil in californai for the city was TWICE the cost of a drum of fresh petroleum - In CA they charge to remove used Oil from Fleets, some other palces in USA they actually pay you to get the used oil, so over all economy has to include the disposal costs, etc.



To the person(trajen),or persons who need verifiable proof....... read the above verifiable post with yet more proof....the Oakland Police dept., and the Major........all not enough proof for you????? Not to mention all the other very informative posts the naysayers have now become speechless over.

The negative naysayers now have also been over inundated with factual and informative data......their(trajen) brains have been overloaded for now!!

They need time to digest this wealth of knowledge and lubricant science bestowed upon them!!

You know what they say.........be careful what you ask for........you might just get it!!!!!
V vitualmageMember
quote:

Hey, Capt. Kirk. Guess what's going to be in Dumb Dumb's next post?

Very interesting info in Miro's posts lately...


For you to don’t realize kirk is miro....dump suit you pretty well, your post are even more irrelevant then the other, all you seems to do is attack trajen….Seriously chill out take a Molson Canadian ,drive to Quebec if you have to ,get some booze and relax ,you seem to need it.
M mirokefurtMember
quote:
vitual_mage

Obviously you have taken too much of your medicine - so someting gets lost in the translation to Canadian French

I am Miro Kefurt and "Kirk" is our long time customer no secret there.

It is Trajan/snakedoctor/++++

That has 5 identities on three different boards.

And his ONLY purpose in life is to bash SynLube and LIE (like the 2007 BMW Z fabrication)

And until he discloses his real name, address and what he really drives around "Turkey Hill" he is just what he is = FAKE LIAR !!!
I inhaliburtonMember
quote:
Originally posted by snakedoctor/trojan:
There is no proof, test data or any validation what so ever for this product. Just one man and and a few parrots squaking how good it is.

Miro has perpetrated this scam for so long he how actually believes it himself. (sad)

Any one else who would believe this is either incredibly naive or just terminally stupid

Hey, Trojan. You forgot this:

The documents to the tests that synlube crows they passed?
Why don't you show them.
No links to a suspect site. Verifiable proof.

Nice of you to take time out of your busy day. Thanks for dropping by.
M mirokefurtMember
quote:
enochca


SynLube Lube-4-Life INITIAL FILL has been the same since 1985, no change in composition Chemistry or anything else.

The fact that other oils fail in field and have to be changed is not our problem but someting for the BIG OIL selling cheap petroleum at BIG PROFIT is the issue - API nor BIG OIL disclose any informations about their tests, so nor do we, that is considered "proprietary" information and "trade-secret".

If you have few million to your name I will be glad to license you our formula.

Otherwise you just have to take real people experience in real cars that they drive in real life as the "proof".

It is quite silly to take any 40 hour Engine Test Stand test as "proof" especially if it is on 1994 engine that is not even produced any more, just check the SEQUENCE Engine tests and what they are actually run on and for how long 216 hours is the "limit" - in City Driving that is LESS than 2,500 miles !!!

There are not even any tests in USA to test the 2010 Low Emission Diesel impact on Motor Oil - only field experience will show few years from now what the problems will be.

And the MSDS regulations in USA have been the same since 1982, only the European have changed in 2004 and 2007.

So any test done in 1990 is still valid today if the substance is the same.

Which it is, even our prices have not changed since 1996, someting we would not be able to do if there was even a drop of PETROLEUM in SynLube.

But it is still cheaper today than it was in 1985 ($50) while prices of CARS have trippled in the same time ! And petroleum products went up FIVE fold...
C captainkirkMember
quote:
Originally posted by Deltona_Dave:
I found a contact for Oakland P.D. I will be dropping him an email on Monday, when I get back to work. I will also send him a letter on Department Letterhead to see if I can get some feed back from their experience with the said patrol cars.

I will let you all know what I find out next week.

Cheers,
Dave


Dave, Hopefully the contact is not a new hire who wouldn't be aware of those cars or have access to the log books of said cars. Just my two cents I thought worth mention. Kirk
D deltonadaveMember
quote:
Originally posted by Captain Kirk:
quote:
Originally posted by Deltona_Dave:
I found a contact for Oakland P.D. I will be dropping him an email on Monday, when I get back to work. I will also send him a letter on Department Letterhead to see if I can get some feed back from their experience with the said patrol cars.

I will let you all know what I find out next week.

Cheers,
Dave


Dave, Hopefully the contact is not a new hire who wouldn't be aware of those cars or have access to the log books of said cars. Just my two cents I thought worth mention. Kirk


The contact I found is the head of Fleet management. These "test" vehicles were supposedly unloaded "auctioned" in late 09, so they should have it on record. If not, I will contact the Chief, he may recall it too.

Dave
C captainkirkMember
quote:
Originally posted by ADFD1:
Miro/Kirk Seems Trajan knows this whole Synlube thing is a scam along with most of us here. Still waiting on proof, not your side step shuffle.

AD


WOW..........ADF1..........Have you been reading any of the above posts with all the additional info that's been provided overall??


What side step shuffle? Trajen is your idle? Trajen knows something?? What??

Nice of you to pop in here with something intellectually stimulating!!

Why don't you try and answer some of the questions this thread is actually about...like......real world results with typical motor oil,sludge,wear,and what VOA/UOA actually tells us compared to what is ultimately occurring inside our engines.

What can you bring to this thread besides derisive remarks over and over again??
I inhaliburtonMember
quote:
Originally posted by Trojan aka snakedoctor:
Synlube claims to pass FTP/AAA tests. Link to the results.

Not some suspect site, a link to the reports on the EPA/AAA sites so that we can all read them.


Tojan/snakedoctor: you must have missed reading this on the previous paqe:

By Miro:

The fact that other oils fail in field and have to be changed is not our problem but someting for the BIG OIL selling cheap petroleum at BIG PROFIT is the issue - API nor BIG OIL disclose any informations about their tests, so nor do we, that is considered "proprietary" information and "trade-secret".

If you have few million to your name I will be glad to license you our formula.

Otherwise you just have to take real people experience in real cars that they drive in real life as the "proof".

It is quite silly to take any 40 hour Engine Test Stand test as "proof" especially if it is on 1994 engine that is not even produced any more, just check the SEQUENCE Engine tests and what they are actually run on and for how long 216 hours is the "limit" - in City Driving that is LESS than 2,500 miles !!!

There are not even any tests in USA to test the 2010 Low Emission Diesel impact on Motor Oil - only field experience will show few years from now what the problems will be.

And the MSDS regulations in USA have been the same since 1982, only the European have changed in 2004 and 2007.

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

So, Trojan aka snakedoctor: Even you should be able to understand from reading the above that you won't be seeing said data. It's been posted serveral times throughout this thread.

You should get back to class before the kindergarten teacher notices you missing. And thanks for dropping by.
A adfd1Member
quote:
Originally posted by Captain Kirk:
quote:
Originally posted by ADFD1:
Miro/Kirk Seems Trajan knows this whole Synlube thing is a scam along with most of us here. Still waiting on proof, not your side step shuffle.

AD




WOW..........ADF1..........Have you been reading any of the above posts with all the additional info that's been provided overall??


What side step shuffle? Trajen is your idle? Trajen knows something?? What??

Nice of you to pop in here with something intellectually stimulating!!

Why don't you try and answer some of the questions this thread is actually about...like......real world results with typical motor oil,sludge,wear,and what VOA/UOA actually tells us compared to what is ultimately occurring inside our engines.

What can you bring to this thread besides derisive remarks over and over again??



Dude, the burden of proof lies with you. You see I'm not shilling anything here, you Kirk, and yourself Miro are the ones failing to convince this group and the BITOG group.

So far about all you have is a good line of Baloney, not much else. I'll give you a "B" for your effort, and an "A" for overall entertainment in all of this nonsense.

As far a Trajan goes, he represents the truth.

AD
S snakedoctorMember
Lets see, his msds have not changed since 1982, well osha did not require msds to be kept till 1986. So is the rest of that tirade in question as well.

And isn't the sequence lVA test run on a Nissan engine.

http://www.swri.org/4org/D08/G.../ivatest/default.htm

http://www.ilpi.com/msds/faq/partb.html#history

http://www.api.org/aboutoilgas...pi-quality-marks.cfm

And yes all this is good for is a good laugh.
Last edited by snakedoctor
T trajanMember
As I pointed out in the other thread, synlube isn't on the list.

Of course, Miro comes back with neither is Quaker State and Pennzoil. And Shell forgot to pay.

Naturally, when it is shown that they are, his comback. "Do you know where on Earth Japan is"

What can one expect from someone who demands my name and address? Or a vin number. Shame he lacks the necessary clearence.
V vitualmageMember
Just is involvement with the Yugo is enough to drive away any customer.....the fact he say they are safe should be enough to prove is sanity level. Area 51, NASA, secret service….no know address, multiple personalities, you did admit you where Kirk, at least be a man and admit this one….stop acting like a piss off teenager , no it’s not me I did nothing wrong….you did it .
T trajanMember
Well, what is enough to drive away any customer, if not the constant refusal to provide verifiable information, is the attitudes displayed by the synlube fans toward anyone who doesn't take their word as gospel.

It isn't up to me, ADFD1, bruce,synskeptic, Big Bear, et al, to prove that this stuff is viable.

That task is for synlube. And they fail at that task. For 56 pages, nothing but failure.

I know someone who sludged up his engine using this stuff. And all I get is grief.

I don't have to prove it doesn't work. You people have to prove it does. And these "testimonials" won't do it. Adult film stars draped on a hood won't do it.

Certainly, the constant barrage of pre school insults launched by miro/kurk/inhal/annie... whta happenned to annie anyway? Oh that's right, that was kirke all along.

But I digress.....

A company that uses mail drops. Sells out of car trunks. Claims to operate out of Mercury Nevada, which by the way, is closed to the general public last I heard.

$32 for a litre of gunk that isn't even API certified, let alone ACEA. And people who don't even use this expect me to buy it.

Nope. Not until I am satisfied that it is what it claims to be. Not until I am satisfied this isn't a scam.

The last 55 pages tell me it is a scam.

http://www.math.uwaterloo.ca/~rblander/snake_oil.txt Scroll down to the part called Psychological placebo. I read that and think synlube. I'll bet inhal is wishing he never found that link.
I inhaliburtonMember
quote:
Originally posted by Trojan aka snakedoctor:

Well, what is enough to drive away any customer, if not the constant refusal to provide verifiable information, is the attitudes displayed by the synlube fans toward anyone who doesn't take their word as gospel.


Who can argue with that. You should go now. You'll be late for kindergarten.

quote:
It isn't up to me, ADFD1, bruce,synskeptic, Big Bear, et al, to prove that this stuff is viable.


Yes. Yes. We all apologize for expecting you to prove that this "stuff" is viable. Ciau.

quote:
That task is for synlube. And they fail at that task. For 56 pages, nothing but failure.


Painfully true, oh wise one. Hasta la vista, baby.

quote:
I know someone who sludged up his engine using this stuff. And all I get is grief.


Oh no. Not another neighbourhood sludger. You should go now. You'll be late for kindergarten.

quote:
I don't have to prove it doesn't work. You people have to prove it does. And these "testimonials" won't do it. Adult film stars draped on a hood won't do it.


Okay. We'll prove anything you want. Check your blood pressure. Tootles.

quote:
Certainly, the constant barrage of pre school insults launched by miro/kurk/inhal/annie... whta happenned to annie anyway? Oh that's right, that was kirke all along.


We feel your pain. Adios amigo.

quote:
But I digress.....


You digress? Never. Parting is such sweet sorrow.

quote:
A company that uses mail drops. Sells out of car trunks. Claims to operate out of Mercury Nevada, which by the way, is closed to the general public last I heard.


Who could argue with that? We'll miss you.

quote:
$32 for a litre of gunk that isn't even API certified, let alone ACEA. And people who don't even use this expect me to buy it.


Don't buy it. Please! Consider your reputation. We are delighted with your appearance.

quote:
Nope. Not until I am satisfied that it is what it claims to be. Not until I am satisfied this isn't a scam.


Yes. Yes. Bye bye. Please come again (NOT).

quote:
The last 55 pages tell me it is a scam.


You certainly have an open mind on the subject. We'll miss you.
C captainkirkMember
quote:
Who can argue with that. You should go now. You'll be late for kindergarten.




inHaliburton I think the issue with trajen is that he hates to admit when is proven wrong. I've done it more than once and he can't deal with it.

I am willing to bet he doesn't even have a car,let alone a Beamer!! He posts 24/7...so we know he at least doesn't drive.

My posts have hours and days of gaps because I also have a life....and a job!!! Just look at his posts on this site and the other. Does he even sleep???
C captainkirkMember
quote:
I know someone who sludged up his engine using this stuff. And all I get is grief.



Trajen..........You have just fabricated another lie after making some 30 post and now another lie just shows up this late in the game. You're busted again! You failed to prove the last lie regarding the beamer z car........so your strategy is to fabricate another lie????
T trajanMember
quote:
Originally posted by Captain Kirk:
quote:
I know someone who sludged up his engine using this stuff. And all I get is grief.



Trajen..........You have just fabricated another lie after making some 30 post and now another lie just shows up this late in the game. You're busted again! You failed to prove the last lie regarding the beamer z car........so your strategy is to fabricate another lie????


And what lie was that? I said I know someone who sludged up his engine using this swill. Same guy I mentioned before.

You are of course at liberty to prove me wrong.
You will fail of course, but take your shot.
T trajanMember
quote:
Originally posted by Captain Kirk:
quote:
Who can argue with that. You should go now. You'll be late for kindergarten.




inHaliburton I think the issue with trajen is that he hates to admit when is proven wrong. I've done it more than once and he can't deal with it.

I am willing to bet he doesn't even have a car,let alone a Beamer!! He posts 24/7...so we know he at least doesn't drive.

My posts have hours and days of gaps because I also have a life....and a job!!! Just look at his posts on this site and the other. Does he even sleep???


How typical. Can't answer the questions, so more of the preschool attacks.

On the synlube site are claims of passing tests. FTP and AAA. And yet, no mention anywhere on the web but at a suspect site.

Where are the tests? Post the links that go right to them so that we may all read the results.
M mirokefurtMember
quote:
Lets see, his msds have not changed since 1982, well osha did not require msds to be kept till 1986. So is the rest of that tirade in question as well.


Apparently you can not even accept the facts presented in your own research, namely:

****

"
It is safe to assume, from all the information I can gather, that by the middle of the nineteenth century, manufacturers where supplying their customers with some sort of data sheet, either along with their product or on demand. Therefore, the parameters of the MSDS, Sections 1, 3, an 9, had been dealt with by this time. The earliest example of an MSDS that I have ever seen is one by Valentine and Company of 1906. I came across this example while doing a research paper for NIOSH in 1980."
***** by Samuel Aaron Kaplan ***

So once again we were actually AHEAD of the OHSA requirements by years, but MDSD were supplied by SynLube Comapany since 1969.

They were called "Handling Instructions and Precautions" as the term MSDS was not used in Canada at that time.

Most tests are on Chevy & FOrd but yes one is on Nissan, because oils that passed the Chevy test ruined engines in Europe and Japan (Diesels) so Nissan sponsored the inclusion of thest on their engine, which also is not manufactured since it was "saved" by Renault.
But they could not get API to accept a Diesel (small truck) engine since no such vehicle are sold in USA, so NISSAN compromised with EFI Gasoline fueled engine - a totally different engine family than the one which had in the field failures in Japan and Europe with then current API oils.

My point is "what is the point" to do artificial tests on obsolete engines from 1990's on oils that are to be used in 2011 designs ?

The general answer is: "We can not afford to run tests on $11,000 engines installed in $30,000 cars", so (my comment) we use $2,000 engines that are no longer manufactured and teh cars they used to be in are long gone.

Yet the same OIL COMPANY will blow $120,000 in a minute to tell you how well their oil fight sludge during a "Golf Game". BS They can afford to run tests on LS 3 and GM will even sell them at a discount for 1/2 the "Suggested Racer Price".

But no THEY (BIG OIL) FEAR to test anything they have on 2010 Camaro or Corvette engine - they know it would fail !!! (One reason they use Mobil 1 as OEM fill, no petroleum oil will make the engine last !)

Using OBSOLETE ENgines for "certification" in 2010 = Just GREAT !!! (Logic)

A logic totally worthy of Trajan/snakedoctor to prove this point that "good" (read it = obsolete ) engines do NOT have any sludge problems, and they are right they do not, they also put out 1/2 the HP than modern engines that hold one less quart of oil do.

The entire automotive industry is based on sales and the 3 to 4 year cycle (anything still in production after 5 years is "dated, no good, obsolete, out of fashion" Just read AUTOWEEK, CAR & DRIVER, AUTOMOBILE and see what they say about car that is more than few years old and still in production !!!)

Yet the lubricant "Industry" is using 1996 GM and 1960's CRL, and 1993 4.6-liter Ford and 1994 Nissan KA 24E 2.4-liter.

Just go to your friendly NISSAN Dealer and tell them you want to buy NEW 1994 engine to run and 100 hour OIL TEST, and you will promptly return it to them for a re-biult as it will we "worn" by then with a "passing" oil that ONLY casued 90 micrometers of wear.

And OH Yes:

DO NOT FORGET to take the engine appart FIRST and measure it:

The twelve cam lobes are each measured at 7 locations, using a surface
profilometer for the measurement of maximum depth of wear.The wear
on all 7 positions of each lobe are added, then all twelve lobes are averaged
for the wear result.This result is the primary evaluation for the test.

The NEW ENGINE service tollerance for the said engine is +/- .25 mm or 500 micro meters - so the engine will be in the OEM specs EVEN with a FAILING OIL.

In my opinion that is really "stupid" - a test that teh worst of lubes (except API SA) will pass with not much of a problem.
M mirokefurtMember
quote:
Why did you claim that Shell/Pennzoil/QS do not have API certs when, unlike your stuff, they clearly do?


GO to "Turkey Hill" and buy PENZOIL EXCELLENT - no really go ahead and try, after all it is just around your corner where you live, and if they do not have it the SHELL Station on the other side of the street will !

ANd do not forget to ask them about QUAKER STATE PROGRESS, well what is the problem ?

May be SHELL HELIX ULTRA should be availble at the MINIMUM after all it is a SHELL Gas Station and they sell ALL SHELL Brands !!!

Go AHEAD, make my day !!! (well night in your case).
M mirokefurtMember
WARRANTY CLAIMS

It is totally true that BIG OIL has no Warranty Reserve, not even SHELL to cover their "Warranty" on the otehr hand Auto Industry always had deep pockets, and any accountant or lawyer that is smart enough to figure that one out, will go after that reserve, no matter what or who is at "fault"

This just out:

***

These figures once again include annual totals for General Motors, thanks to a surprise fin]ling the company made with the U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission yesterday. The company, now owned by the U.S. Treasury Department and others, remains the largest warranty provider based in the U.S., paying out a reported $4.1 billion for claims in 2009.

As an illustration of how drastically the problems of the U.S. auto industry manifested themselves in warranty financing, consider that GM had $9.6 billion in its warranty reserve at the end of 2007. At the end of last year, that balance was down to $7.0 billion. In 2007, Ford paid out $4 billion in claims. Last year it paid out $2.5 billion. Some of that cost reduction comes thanks to better quality, but much of it comes from fewer sales.

****

In summary various industries paid out 25.2 billion total in claims in 2009 - BIG OIL is not even on the list !!!

It is bunched up in "Other" which is just 0.25 %

Auto Industry is 37% of that TOTAL !!!
V vitualmageMember
I luv Nissan engine, rb25det, rb26det....vr38dett, Chevrolet are amazing to, the ls9 engine is just plain amazing. Engine have never been so reliable, we live in an era where the engine will outperform the rest of the vehicle. My only concern will be from the new generation of mechanics, tend to always use the computer to fix problems instead of listening the engine.

The problem will come from stealership and the user, not the oil or the engine in the vehicle, as long the vehicle hold until the warranty is over no issued right? Customer is to blame to…people have no time, want everything now, drop the key at the dealer, take them at the end of the day job done.

When you are fueling up how much people open their hood check the fluid level, take a peek at their tire pressure, check is they see any leek on the engine…close to none all they do is filling up the windshield washer.

Why would you blame the oil company then? Their product did work as expected, even did better then expected if you take the user in consideration.

Remember back in the days, the mechanic will take your vehicle for a test drive with you, then show you the broken part, tell you before hand the price and the alternative ,you knew the job will be done right. Remember the weekends; you will see people doing their own oil change each 2 or 3 month, cleaning and waxing their car almost each week, pulling out the spark plug to read them. People where taking better care of their stuff plain simple, still compare to all the vehicle today these vehicle needed way more maintenance.

If you where to take a vehicle from today and give it to someone from the 60s….you can be sure this vehicle would go over 300k without any major problem and would be kept for year and in good shape .
M mirokefurtMember
quote:
vitual_mage


I totally agree with you except that in my opinion and experinece I have seen the PEAK of reliability in mid 1980's.

EFI did away with Carburettor, EI with the points and condenser and spark plug changes.

Due to the horrific failures in 1970's due to early untested smog reduction experiments (smog pump, catalysts that melted things, etc.) the metalurgy was beafed up to way above what was the MINIMUM needed for "durability".

Then for 26 years every manufacturer went back to the supplier and DEMANDED that the parts be made "cheper" ! And can be assembled "faster" and never mind access or serviceablity after initial assembly...

I have even seen Memo from Chrysler to BOSCH demanding price reduction and the justification was "quote" "THERE IS NO REASON FOR A FUEL INJECTOR TO LAST LONGER THAN 100,000 miles"

TODAY it is a Lap top computer (and sometimes as many as 70 embeded controllers) that run everything electronically.

Just take your 10 year old Lap top to a computer store for repair - and they laugh you out (or kick you out) if you do not buy a new one on the spot.

Same will be true with 2010 car in 2020 - it may look great, be mechanically perfect, but it will not run because this or that chip that failed was discontinued form production 7 years back and being proprietary is not available at any cost, period !

FORD already does not have electronic parts for some LINCOLNS that are only 5 years old ~!!

(Like controller that runs the cooling fan on radiator which is prone to failure = engine overheat = time for new LINCOLN)

The PENNZOIL 500,000 mile Warranty is absolutely no risk to SHELL, the cars just will not run that long no matter what, and it will not be the oil that will kill them either -
- but the electronics will.
E enochcaMember
Miro i dont care about Memo from Chrysler or laptop era.....i just want to know did you have any document like you said...your product pass the test? and Can we laugh too in this forum..? same with those computer repair store when you give us 1990 test to this 2010?....I see in this forum ...you like to talk about around-around in the sky if we ask about this document, so can you provide us your copy of document?
thanks,
enoch
A adfd1Member
Still waiting on facts. My dad owns a 20+ YO Ford, never had problems getting parts, any part, in fact the engine in it has been discontinued several years ago.

Fuel Injectors made to last only 100,000 miles? Tell that to my 3.0L engine approaching 200,000 miles and running strong on dino oil and P1 filters.

Just wondering who does a customer see, and where do they go/call if they have an engine failure using Synlube? Do they run to open desert space in NV hoping to get beamed to the Synlube suite on the Enterprise?

The way I see it the Synlube warranty is no risk to Synlube either, just try and locate them.

AD
E enochcaMember
Dear AD,
who said Fuel injector made to last only 100,000 miles? its Miro again?yes......hmm how about my car and my friends car in our club(have 30 cars with XU10J2 engine, Magneti Marreli MP8.0 ECU, waste-spark ignition systems) this KM in the dasboard have a 250,000 to 350,000 KM and still use the same injector/same ECU with 5000KM fuel injector cleaner like redline S1 or another brand put in the gasoline or ultrasonic. some use dino oil some use semi synth oil.
So Miro...can you give us your document?
enoch
A adfd1Member
quote:
I have even seen Memo from Chrysler to BOSCH demanding price reduction and the justification was "quote" "THERE IS NO REASON FOR A FUEL INJECTOR TO LAST LONGER THAN 100,000 miles"



My Uncle has a 318 in a Dodge Ram used for hauling a boat, with close to 175,000 miles. I sent him a link to this discussion he was rolling on the floor he said in an email. His Ram PU runs like a clock. He can't believe this thread survived 57 pages, and not one fact with any proof about Synlube was posted, just a lot of BS from 1 shill with a few names as he put it.

AD
T trajanMember
Typical scam artist Miro is. Can't answer questions. Can't back his claims.

Can't even expalin why Shell/Pennzoil/QS has API certs in spite of the fact he claims they don't.

Must be really upset his juice couldn't even get them.

Miro/kirk talks alot, yet says little.

Can he produce this "memo" that says FIs only last 100,000 miles? I'm guessing.....no.

And, as kirk spouts when caught in a situation he can't handle, FIs are not the topic.

So, miro, explain what fuel injectors, or laptops, etc has to do with synlube?

The fact of the matter is that if you had passed such tests, we would of seen the documents long ago.

But you and the rest of the brain dead trust have done everything except produce them.
Last edited by trajan
M mirokefurtMember
Ask SHELL to produce any TEST documents and published on line, if you succeed then I will in 15 minutes publish everything on line too.

Till then all those tests and the results are proprietary information that is considered "trade-secret" and we are also bound by signed legal agreement with Mobil and AAA and FORD not to disclose anything to anyone in detail without a PRIOR WRITTEN PERMISSION, from them that NAMES the recipient of the information.

SO you have to DISCLOSE your NAME, ADDRESS, etc, FIRST and then on your behalf we can ask for such permission.

The Agreement terms standard in the industry I have published more than once and so far no one can understand the simple legal language.

LIKE WRITTEN PERMISSION IN ADVANCE OF DISCLOSURE.

(Personally I doubt that anyone who can not understand the difference between Houston and Tokyo, can!)

We do not make the Laws or Rules, we just have to follow them.

Send e-mail To South West Technical Institute and demand they disclose to you any OIL TEST they have done recently and see what they will tell you.

DO the same with ExxonMobil, AMSOIL, SHELL, BP.

And none of that "Independent Lab" did this or that - NAME THE LAB, Reference the TEST NUMBER, provide the DATE.

That is also what is considered a legal proof by FTC - the data itself is "proprietary" always was, and always will be - and if you are NOT a Judge in FTC case, or work for the referenced company the test data is none of your business !

So where is the MINIMUM that is needed to provide a legal proof as per FTC for AMSOIL, SHELL, EXXONMOBIL, BP,?

I want to see it "FIRST"

Ours is ALREADY on your web !!!

Just read it !!!


Project Description: SynLube Lubricants Long Term Test

AAA Project Identification Number: 81

Project Number: 2002-0317-1

Project Begin Date: 2/26/2002

Project Finish Date: 7/6/2007

And for CARB reference

Certification:

I certify under the penalty of perjury under the laws of the State of California, That I performed the inspection in accordance with all bureau requirements, and that the information listed on this vehicle inspection report is true and correct.

Technician Name: Robert Shirvanyan Technician Number: EA149136 Station Number: RM208755 Smog Certificate Number: NI353286 Date: 04/24/2009


You have all the data and if you hire a Lawyer you can through a Judge ask for "discovery" but you have to show a Legal Cause, to get one !!!
M mirokefurtMember
quote:
The fan controler is an easy fix.....always been always will.

http://www.dccontrol.com/fancontrol.htm


Thanks for the link, I will send it to who ever has such I can not get OEM controller from OEM Dealer syndrome.

Most people that own LINCOLNS (check their average age) to not play with their own cars, and if their FORD-LINCOLN-MERCURY Dealer tells them it can not be fixed they take their word for it from them.

There even was Long Article about this in Los Angeles Times - they even called FORD Direct and talked with the "Parts VP for NA" and he told them there is no obligation for FORD to keep any parts available once the vehicle is past the OEM Warrnty - and they quoted him.

THere are geeks that can fix their Lap top sometimes, or even re-wire Hybrid Batteries, but the majority of the populus can not do it, just as 60% of vehicle owners in USA are NOT CAPABLE to change their own oil, and 45% never opened their hood - real life real facts (Research from JD POWER).

There is legal requirement to ahve 300 page owner manual, but almost no one ever reads one (98.3%) the most common look at owner manual documented by FORD is to find out how to adjust the CLOCK when the time changes (Spring Fall).

Yet you can get $10,000 fine from NHTSA is you leave out one page about "advanced air bag" or the fact that childrent have to sit in the back seat....

The CHRYSLER Memo did not say the injectors last 100,000 miles, it specifically stated and I again for the 3rd time repeat:

THERE IS NO REASON FOR FUEL INJECTORS TO LAST MORE THAN 100,000 miles

and it was part of DEMAND to reduce the per unit cost by BOSCH - back in 2003

I did nto say I had it, I say I saw it and I can testify to it in Congresional Hearing if you institute it.

BOSCH has it at their Michigan Headquarters and they showed it to me with pride, to demonstrate how good their stuff is !!!

And I do know I have some BERTONE X1/9 with 200,000+ miles form 1980's with OEM BOSCH EFI and no problems.

But the system BOSCH made in 1980 is not available at any price today - we wanted it in 2003 and I was told it was too expensive (about $495 pre car) - SO NO ONE WAS BUIYNG IT and they quit making it in 1994 since it did not have OBD.

The average cost of EFI on today's vehicle is $175 - that is the ENTIRE EFI system - then go to your dealer and try to buy just one injector, or fuel pump, etc.

But it takes $163,000 to "calibrate" and MAP the $175 system.

The 1979 BOSCH EFI was self calibrating and if you installed it on any engine with 2, 4 or 6 cylinders from 600 cc to 2.5 L - in 4 minutes after initial ON, it fugured out the proper calibration, itself, and without any CPU !!!

30 years later and such "advanced" technology is not manufactured !!! - it was too much for volume OEM.

And you's think any OEM woudl spend $500 to permanently lube any vehicle if they will not invest it into EFI ?

So it indeed has to do with SynLube - long term reliability and long term durability is NOT a desirable feature for volume OEM on any vehicle.

It on other hand is for BREMACH it uses SynLube as OEM fill for all vehicles to be sold in USA.

But in 2009 they made 309 vehicles world wide -

www.bremach.it

So for very few like BERTONE, MORETTI in the past SynLube is the ONLY WAY TO GO !!!
C c3poMember
quote:
There even was Long Article about this in Los Angeles Times - they even called FORD Direct and talked with the "Parts VP for NA" and he told them there is no obligation for FORD to keep any parts available once the vehicle is past the OEM Warrnty - and they quoted him.


I was under the impression that all auto manufactures are supposed to keep parts for 10 years after the car is sold.

So a 2001 Chevrolet Monte Carlo would have parts that were available from the Dealer until 2011.

If Ford is not required to keep any parts past the 3 year 36,000 miles Warranty are you recommending that Ford Owner's should not even use Synlube.

Do you know of any other car manufactures that keep parts in there inventory for 10 years or more, the reason being is that since your oil is so GOOD, anyone using Synlube would expect there engines to last at least 25 years or 500,000 miles.

If these automakers are not going to hold onto parts or not be required to hold onto parts when the warranty is over then maybe we should all just use the cheapest oil and not even think of using Synlube, why should I use the best oil when I have to worry about not being able to get parts for my car.

Miro, you have given everyone here the perfect reason not to use Synlube unless you decide to go into the parts business and sell us our parts when the manufacture no longer carries it.
T trajanMember
quote:
Originally posted by Miro Kefurt:
quote:
Miro, I hit the link above and nothing came up, can you print it out for us to see here.


It is not a link just the exact identification number for the test project issued by AAA Auto Research Lab.


So produce the test. we want to read it. Of course, the only site said test comes up doing kirk's favorite line "Google it.", is a suspect synlube site.

Nothing from Ford or the AAA.

Oh, BTW, I've never had trouble getting OEM parts for the 64 Buick Le Sabre or the 68 Chevy Nova I had when they were both 20 years old.
I inhaliburtonMember
quote:
Originally posted by Trjan aka snakedoctor:
quote:
Originally posted by Miro Kefurt:
quote:
Miro, I hit the link above and nothing came up, can you print it out for us to see here.


It is not a link just the exact identification number for the test project issued by AAA Auto Research Lab.


So produce the test. we want to read it. Of course, the only site said test comes up doing kirk's favorite line "Google it.", is a suspect synlube site.

Nothing from Ford or the AAA.


You bozos can't tell a link from a non-link. No wonder you can't understand what Miro has been telling you for days, weeks, months, YEARS.
C captainkirkMember
quote:
Originally posted by inHaliburton:
quote:
Originally posted by Trjan aka snakedoctor:
quote:
Originally posted by Miro Kefurt:
quote:
Miro, I hit the link above and nothing came up, can you print it out for us to see here.


It is not a link just the exact identification number for the test project issued by AAA Auto Research Lab.


So produce the test. we want to read it. Of course, the only site said test comes up doing kirk's favorite line "Google it.", is a suspect synlube site.

Nothing from Ford or the AAA.


You bozos can't tell a link from a non-link. No wonder you can't understand what Miro has been telling you for days, weeks, months, YEARS.


inHaliburton....Look what trajen is talking about on the other thread with ADF1,cp30 etc.

MMO and auto-rx....and they all use those products admitting sludge issues/concerns.

All those naysayers are talking about and using products that are designed to remove sludge!!

Marvel mystery motor oil....auto-rx........all in an effort to address sludge. Why?? They are admitting that sludge is an issue on the other thread by using those products.

Wow....the truth finally comes out!!!
C captainkirkMember
quote:
Originally posted by ADFD1:
Still waiting on facts. My dad owns a 20+ YO Ford, never had problems getting parts, any part, in fact the engine in it has been discontinued several years ago.

Fuel Injectors made to last only 100,000 miles? Tell that to my 3.0L engine approaching 200,000 miles and running strong on dino oil and P1 filters.

Just wondering who does a customer see, and where do they go/call if they have an engine failure using Synlube? Do they run to open desert space in NV hoping to get beamed to the Synlube suite on the Enterprise?

The way I see it the Synlube warranty is no risk to Synlube either, just try and locate them.

AD


It was not stated the car stops running at 100k...give me a break.... It's already proven that after 100k the fuel spray pattern is out of spec and the injectors should be replaced because emissions are higher and or the cat is doing more work to clean up the exhaust.

It's all about emissions now days. The EPA wants all cars to have ultra low emissions and stay ultra low for as long as possible. However...after a 100k on a typical car emissions start going up!!

AT 200k....your car would be much higher than when it had 50k...even if the check engine light is not on..your cars emissions are higher. That was the whole point basically.
C captainkirkMember
quote:
Originally posted by ADFD1:
quote:
I have even seen Memo from Chrysler to BOSCH demanding price reduction and the justification was "quote" "THERE IS NO REASON FOR A FUEL INJECTOR TO LAST LONGER THAN 100,000 miles"



My Uncle has a 318 in a Dodge Ram used for hauling a boat, with close to 175,000 miles. I sent him a link to this discussion he was rolling on the floor he said in an email. His Ram PU runs like a clock. He can't believe this thread survived 57 pages, and not one fact with any proof about Synlube was posted, just a lot of BS from 1 shill with a few names as he put it.

AD


I am glad to see on the other thread you admit your family uses products like marvel mystery oil and auto-rx.........to remove sludge.

So that is why that engine with only 175k is running so good as you say.........you have to over maintain them... and flush them of sludge on regular basis with mmo/auto-rx....

now I am rolling on the floor with laughter.

The whole point of this thread was that store bought oils have issues...and now you finally admit there are issues on the other thread titled MMO or auto-rx.

Finally the truth comes out....it's about time..... it took long enough!!!
Last edited by captainkirk
C captainkirkMember
quote:
Tell that to my 3.0L engine approaching 200,000 miles and running strong on dino oil and P1 filters.


However...you admit on the thread titled MMO or auto rx..........you are using sludge removing products to accomplish 200k. Why??

The whole point of this thread was to show that dino oil and group III synthetic cause the very problems you are trying to address with the solvent based chlorine spiked MMO. Yes..MMO does have chlorine...did you know that?

Why are you using auto-rx in addition to mmo?

Did you see the valve picks on this forum showing that the auto rx did not clean up the massive sludge in that engine??

Why not use 100% PAO premium group IV synthetic oils in the first place and avoid those issues in the first place.

The P1 filter restricts oil by the way especially petroleum oil.
I inhaliburtonMember
quote:


You bozos can't tell a link from a non-link. No wonder you can't understand what Miro has been telling you for days, weeks, months, YEARS.


quote:
inHaliburton....Look what trajen is talking about on the other thread with ADF1,cp30 etc.

MMO and auto-rx....and they all use those products admitting sludge issues/concerns.

All those naysayers are talking about and using products that are designed to remove sludge!!

Marvel mystery motor oil....auto-rx........all in an effort to address sludge. Why?? They are admitting that sludge is an issue on the other thread by using those products.

Wow....the truth finally comes out!!!


Capt. Kirk: Nice work!

It's mighty quiet out there since you dropped that A bomb. They must be in a huddle trying to figure out a come-back. The native are restless...
I inhaliburtonMember
quote:
Originally posted by Captain Kirk:


quote:
inHaliburton....Look what trajen is talking about on the other thread with ADF1,cp30 etc.

MMO and auto-rx....and they all use those products admitting sludge issues/concerns.

All those naysayers are talking about and using products that are designed to remove sludge!!

Marvel mystery motor oil....auto-rx........all in an effort to address sludge. Why?? They are admitting that sludge is an issue on the other thread by using those products.

Wow....the truth finally comes out!!!

Yes, I just finished reading that thread. It does sound like conflicting info. Maybe they can explain why they use the stuff if they are satisfied with their motor oils.

Personally, I have not used any additives in the current car, 2005 Focus, 275 000 kms.

Sorry to ask, but memory is bad. What do you drive, engine, bought new or used, when started using Synlube, have you had the valve covers off, your thoughts on the product. In all these pages, I can't remember.

Thanks.
I inhaliburtonMember
quote:
Originally posted by vitual_mage:
InHaliburton I’ve noticed that you never let a thought interrupt the flow of your conversation,was that your conclusion, or simply the point in the conversation where you got tired of thinking?

No offense to you Vitual, but I do not understand. I know it's a Jeep thing with you, but could it be that you have received one to many bumps on the head from bouncing up and down in that tightly sprung Jeep? Salute!
C captainkirkMember
quote:
Originally posted by inHaliburton:
quote:
Originally posted by Captain Kirk:


quote:
inHaliburton....Look what trajen is talking about on the other thread with ADF1,cp30 etc.

MMO and auto-rx....and they all use those products admitting sludge issues/concerns.

All those naysayers are talking about and using products that are designed to remove sludge!!

Marvel mystery motor oil....auto-rx........all in an effort to address sludge. Why?? They are admitting that sludge is an issue on the other thread by using those products.

Wow....the truth finally comes out!!!

Yes, I just finished reading that thread. It does sound like conflicting info. Maybe they can explain why they use the stuff if they are satisfied with their motor oils.

Personally, I have not used any additives in the current car, 2005 Focus, 275 000 kms.

Sorry to ask, but memory is bad. What do you drive, engine, bought new or used, when started using Synlube, have you had the valve covers off, your thoughts on the product. In all these pages, I can't remember.

Thanks.


The cars that had it were used cars when I bought them.

1991- Cadillac Eldorado 4.9 V-8 140,000 used. Totaled head on at 169,000. Synlube had about 25,000 on it if memory servers. Engine was running very perfect,car was sports car fast....always passed emission. Valve train... like budman showed on his car....was seen with oil fill cap off and Looked very clean to me. Synlube cleaned that engine Up! Too bad for the accident. Loved that car!

1995 Pontiac 3.1 Gran prix. Used. Installed synlube at around 33,000 miles. Car ran perfect,clean engine(oil cap off). Always past NJ state Inspection. 23 Mpg average.

Filters cut open all were clean. Care saw amsoil for a while at first which cleaned the engine I'm sure. Intake manifold gasket leaked some coolant into the Synlube. Bars stop leak fixed that and a good drive dried out the oil.

At 76,000 last march car was traded in for new 2009 v6 mustang. Car ran perfect,engine still clean even though some coolant got into synlube...that was impressive!! Synlube drained out looking good and sent back for 100% credit,new oil I got free is now in the mustang.

2001.5 VW 1.8t bought used with 38,000 miles. Saw amsoil for a while to prove engine was good and help clean the engine. Installed synlube at 50,000. Car now has 68,000. Engine is perfect. Valvetrain through cap looks clean. Last filter cut open looked clean. Always passes state inspection....never any issues. Car run perfect!

1996 buick riviera. 3.8 series II engine 205 HP. Used again. Synlube at 114,000 miles.
Car was traded in at 178,000 with synlube still in car(forgot to drain/sales pressure)...transmission was acting up!(never synlubed the tranny). The engine ran perfect. Never any emission issues. Cut open filers...clean. Sylube had 64,000 miles on it. I did do several oil filter changes because car was very used...but good. Engine was running flawless when traded. I'm still ticked for not draining out the synlube for credit. oh well!

2008 Brand new Jeep Grand Cherokee Ltd.4.7 V8(303 Hp). Nice engine. Synlubed at 700 Miles in August of 2008. Jeep now has 14,500 on it. That Jeep is a runner Man. I will keep you posted on the jeep. So far,so Very Good.

I am going to follow with the JeeP and the Mustang the 50,000 drain interval and get 100% credit for new oil....hey why not...it's free from now on. I Plan on the maximum engine life schedule. Leaving it in for 150k is for "normal" life.

I can't see past the oil fill cap on the stang or the Jeep,my view is blocked...I'm not worried...I've seen what it can do!!

It's also in the 7Hp over head briggs lawn mower,Honda Snow Bower,etc.etc. lawn equipment! I am not going to ever drain out of the lawn mower just to see what it can do.

The last lawn mower saw 250 hours run time/ 7 years on engine with synlube and ran perfect always..no engine isssues ever...and the crappy yardman mowers wheels fell off twice,power drive kept braking....bought a new craftsmen two years ago,much better overall mower. The other yard-man mower I put out to the curb with only the engine still be being the best running perfect part.....mower was gone the next day.

So far,I have not ever had any engine issues ever using this product. The engine outlives the equipment. The real ultimate test is always the fleet users who use run with Synlube. I wonder who went the longest so far?
M mirokefurtMember
quote:
I was under the impression that all auto manufactures are supposed to keep parts for 10 years after the car is sold.


Lot of people have that impression, not even sure where that tale came form !! (Was it BITOG)

Show me the NHTSA or EPA law that states so !

The only requirement in USA is to have parts that can support 9% of production of 26 vehicles (which eve is less) for the duration of the Emission Performance Warranty and have those parts available within 24 hours to the dealer.

That is CARB and EPA "regulation" but not a LAW.

Law however is that if there is 26 successive failures of any emission part the EPA has to be notified, if the MFG fails to do so, like Mercedes-Benz neglected to do for 10 years, they get fined for that, not for NOT HAVING the parts, but for NOT REPORTING the failures that cause Air Pollution (exhaust or gas tank evaporative) that is part of the Clean Air Act and sicn ethat was passed by congress and signed by respective presidents in office for the updates it is the ONLY LAW that requires any part to be available.

Part availability during Warranty Period is what MFG view as "obligation" to their customers, but they do not even have to do that.

PS: The duration of the Emission performance warranty is either 70 or 80% of the maximum certified useful life which today ranges from 100,000 to 150,000 miles

Except in California where since 2010 the certified life is 120,000 miles for the power train (or 150,000 if PZEV) and 150,000 for the evaporative.

Note the Evaporative is LONGER than the powertrain as in the CA opinion car can break down (not run) and be parked for several years with fuel in the tank, and they do not want parked junkers to pollute the air !!!

Kind a smart move, in my humble opinion.

Also explain this trend:

in 2009 MORE vehicles junked (about 14 million) than sold (about 10.4 million)

Average age of the vehicles on the road 9.2 years.

BUT most amazing the average age of the taken out of service vehicle is only 6.8 years, that means that more and more OLD vehicles remain in service - and much younger vehicles get taken out of service.

And that includes the 690,000 + clunkers that averaged 14 years (median 13 years) in age !!!

The most common MY traded-in was 1995, then 1997 and 1998

The oldest year applicable 1984, which you would expect to be the MOST as those vehicles if they even run have no resale value was only 0.27% - only 2005 MY was lower (0.04%).

So again really old cars that really would not be worth $4,500 to anyone were actually NOT traded-in that often !!!


So this trend indeed proves with 95% confidence level in statistics that NEW vehicles (more recent MY) do not last as long as the older vehicles still in service (older MY).

Again I rest my case and await the verdict by jury !
Last edited by mirokefurt
M mirokefurtMember
ON Longevity:

Vehicle Age
(Passenger Car)
Estimated
Survivability
(1977 to 2002 NVPP)
Estimated VMT
(2001 NHTS)
Weighted Yearly
Travel Miles
1 0.99 14,231 14,089
2 0.9831 13,961 13,725
3 0.9731 13,669 13,300
4 0.9593 13,357 12,813
5 0.9413 13,028 12,262
6 0.9188 12,683 11,652
7 0.8918 12,325 10,991
8 0.8604 11,956 10,287
9 0.8252 11,578 9,554
10 0.7866 11,193 8,804
11 0.717 10,804 7,746
12 0.6125 10,413 6,378
13 0.5094 10,022 5,105
14 0.4142 9,633 3,990
15 0.3308 9,249 3,060
16 0.2604 8,871 2,310
17 0.2028 8,502 1,724
18 0.1565 8,144 1,275
19 0.12 7,799 936
20 0.0916 7,469 684
21 0.0696 7,157 498
22 0.0527 6,866 362
23 0.0399 6,596 263
24 0.0301 6,350 191
25 0.0227 6,131 139
Estimated Passenger Car Lifetime VMT 152,137
Source: NHTSA, Vehicle Survivability and Travel Mileage Schedule, 2006

Notice that after 13 years you have 50/50 chance that your car will quit - even coin toss chance.

After 25 years so few cars are in service they do not bother to find/count them.
M mirokefurtMember
Even today you can buy parts for WV Bug (made in China) but not from VW dealer.

You can buy all the 1960's FORD Mustang parts but not from FORD.

No OEM currently has a Business model to keep old cars on the road, NONE.

In the past only two companies ever made effort to have parts for OLD cars:

1.) PORSCHE - and that got reduced recently

2.) ROLLS-ROYCE - and that got cancelled by the new German owners - as "idiotical business tactic, that has no place in modern world" Quote from German Auto magazine when they had article on recent auction of all BENTLEY and ROLLS ROYCE parts they had in inventory - some for 1928 and 1932 vehicles that they only made hand full of !!!

I used to have 1969 RR Shadow and had absolutely no problem from Chaisson Motors (RR Dealer)to get anything and everything (at a price of course) the moment Germans took over - they went out of business (the RR Dealer, the only one in Las Vegas) and no more RR parts at ANY PRICE - only a RR junk yars in Brentwood, CA would have them (used and new) - and eventually I sold them my SynLube'd RR - just so other RR fanatics could derive benefit from it.

BREMACH is the only Italian company I know of still in business that can from their parts inventory MAKE NEW 25 years ago model !!!

I actually saw them make one when I was there last November - amazing !!! (EXTREME)

But that is 4x4 6Ton truck - not too practical for driving on Las Vegas Blvd.

But hey it will be a hit in Mercury !!!!
V vitualmageMember
Part is easily available, lots of them are generic, and most can be adapted if needed. We use to make junk setup out of some Volkswagen using the 1.8 liter engine couple years ago, ecu from corrado g60, engine head from a g60,oil pan turbo and downpipe from a 1.6 td or 1.9td,voila you had around 170 hp for very low costunder 800 box. Useless example… yes, the point?

All this info is easily available on the net; everyone can read and turn a wrench, yet people don’t want to, they want to turn the key and drive A to B, why would you blame the auto maker? The user asking maintenance free vehicle, user don’t want to get involve, user are the one changing vehicle each 4 year because they want it new ,all they care about is the 2010 label on it.

Lots of part can be take from another model, be rebuilt like new, found in near new condition in most scrap yard, hell they even have an online database now nationwide, telling you the shape of the part you need…..After market offer a wide variety of part, most of them better then oem.

So are vehicle less reliable? No, not at all customer are, tell me why if you go in some other country, they can run the same vehicle for twice the mileage? We need to change our mentality , people rather buy again and again instead of fixing or overhauling stuff. The Wal-Mart generation, don’t need to pay when it broke ill just buy another one.