Refute me - I dare you!
Read our primer articles on High Mileage Oil, Synthetic Oil and Kinematic Viscosity
I will not resort to ad hominem arguments any more - but the debate over your company's product 'Lube4Life' is based upon the misconception that you are on this board as a mere user of the products which you are hawking. I will not engage in a debate with someone who is here for the express purpose of getting attention for his personally owned company - remember, I still have copies of all of our correspondance. I know what you are and who you are. I dare you to refute my comments here! Are you not one Miro Kifurt, owner of the company - Lube4Life A.K.A. "Synlube"? ANSWER?
Excuuuuuuuuse me..... Miro Kefurt! Is that American?
Terry Krueger is German...... we were the first to use P-A-O's in 1939 in our high altitude aircraft torbochaargers and Jet Engines, NO?
A.J. Amatuzio made use of used P-A-O Synthetic Jet oil from his Air Force F-86 to conduct his first 'cold start' experiments in his personal vehilce in the frigid starting conditions in Minnesota, my home state in 1968-69. From there he went on to start the AMZOIL company. Pennzoil got twisted about his use of the 'Z' in the name so he changes it to an 'S'. His pioneering work, in the field of synthetic engine oils, led recently to Wal-Mart coming to him [Read the artilce in the months LUBES'N'GREASES article] .... with a check for $40,000,000 to put his products in their stores. He turned them down for obvious reasons. "An now you know the rest of the story."
Synlube no one is questioning amsoils capabilities I know it intimately, I've been using it longer than you've been" Power Up Lubricants Representative for 14 years! "
However lets step back a little bit and rethink, when amsoil was touting it's 1yr 25k drain how many individuals embraced such a concept way too radical, how many were in disbelief of it's capabilities. Even mobil1 jump on the bandwagon and couldn't substantiate their claims and withdrew it's statement. Yet Amsoil persevered.
Nonetheless it took a long while for people to get use to the concept of not draining the oil past 3k or even 2k. Many naysayers and critics hurled a number or attacks against amsoil for propagating such a radical idea. For that matter much of the disbelief regarding synthetic oil was predicated on opinionated bias, without substantiation and so people were convinced because the local mechanic and Johns great grand dad said no way, what's wrong with you, we've been doing this for years and you can't convince me, and now you couple that with the car manufacturer discouraging such a proposterous notion of extended oil drains, despite oil analysis proving otherwise.
Point is people have been conditioned and indoctrinated to believe without questioning, don't fix it if it isn't broke, despite the increase in technology yes even within the oil industry. Addtionally those who tried amsoil did so without oil analysis sort of a leap of faith, and many have become to this day strong proponents of synthetics, again despite the fact that most did not even seek testing data to prove to themselves Amsoil was viable, maybe they were ignorant, not aware such data existed or how to obtain it, yet they based there decision on the marketing put before them or because a certain friend uses it, and so reasoned he had no problems it must be good.
A goodly portion being ancedotal.
I believe we've again encounter a much similar situation that Amsoil faced, and look how it stood against the giants within the oil industry, it had some very humble beginings.
So we need bear in mind that it's quite possible or probable that a lubrication company such as SYNLUBE may be in it's humble stages as well trying to go against the tide promoting a radical concept as no oil changes for 150k or 15yrs, just as amsoil did with it's 1yr 25k drain regiment.
And the question arise could it be that such technology does exist could it be that SYNLUBE might have something here that others may have missed or chosen not to explore, the possiblity is worth exploring rather than tear down, open mindednes is key to knowledge.
However lets step back a little bit and rethink, when amsoil was touting it's 1yr 25k drain how many individuals embraced such a concept way too radical, how many were in disbelief of it's capabilities. Even mobil1 jump on the bandwagon and couldn't substantiate their claims and withdrew it's statement. Yet Amsoil persevered.
Nonetheless it took a long while for people to get use to the concept of not draining the oil past 3k or even 2k. Many naysayers and critics hurled a number or attacks against amsoil for propagating such a radical idea. For that matter much of the disbelief regarding synthetic oil was predicated on opinionated bias, without substantiation and so people were convinced because the local mechanic and Johns great grand dad said no way, what's wrong with you, we've been doing this for years and you can't convince me, and now you couple that with the car manufacturer discouraging such a proposterous notion of extended oil drains, despite oil analysis proving otherwise.
Point is people have been conditioned and indoctrinated to believe without questioning, don't fix it if it isn't broke, despite the increase in technology yes even within the oil industry. Addtionally those who tried amsoil did so without oil analysis sort of a leap of faith, and many have become to this day strong proponents of synthetics, again despite the fact that most did not even seek testing data to prove to themselves Amsoil was viable, maybe they were ignorant, not aware such data existed or how to obtain it, yet they based there decision on the marketing put before them or because a certain friend uses it, and so reasoned he had no problems it must be good.
A goodly portion being ancedotal.
I believe we've again encounter a much similar situation that Amsoil faced, and look how it stood against the giants within the oil industry, it had some very humble beginings.
So we need bear in mind that it's quite possible or probable that a lubrication company such as SYNLUBE may be in it's humble stages as well trying to go against the tide promoting a radical concept as no oil changes for 150k or 15yrs, just as amsoil did with it's 1yr 25k drain regiment.
And the question arise could it be that such technology does exist could it be that SYNLUBE might have something here that others may have missed or chosen not to explore, the possiblity is worth exploring rather than tear down, open mindednes is key to knowledge.
Well I must concede, gsleve has finally posted a wonderful counterpoint to the nay sayers of Synlube, myself included. I have only been using synthetics for 15 years, and only started extended drain intervals (mind you only 10-15,000 miles as well) in the last 10 of those years.
I've used just about everything out there, always looking for bigger and better. Hell, I even started the vegetable oil topic for some input, and that met with resistance and nay sayers, because not so long ago, mention the term vegetable oil and most people think of castor oil, which would most definitely NOT work in most of today's automobiles very well. But alas, I did some homework, read the web pages of information on the product, called up the company, talked for a while, and decided to give their product a go. I currently use it in three vehicles, and it seems to doing just fine.
I've used just about everything out there, always looking for bigger and better. Hell, I even started the vegetable oil topic for some input, and that met with resistance and nay sayers, because not so long ago, mention the term vegetable oil and most people think of castor oil, which would most definitely NOT work in most of today's automobiles very well. But alas, I did some homework, read the web pages of information on the product, called up the company, talked for a while, and decided to give their product a go. I currently use it in three vehicles, and it seems to doing just fine.
Synlube? Refute you? I wouldn't waste my time. You're just a sad person. But for the record, I am not Miro Kefurt and I think GSLEVE will attest to that.
GSLEVE: Excellent point. I wish I'd thought of it.
GSLEVE: Excellent point. I wish I'd thought of it.
Sorry, hit the wrong button...
To continue, I guess that we might be going about condemning Synlube's product this way based on cost, or that we have been programmed to believe that a product that could possibly last that long, without changing, couldn't possibly be true or work.
I have learned the very hard way to listen to the more experienced than I in most lubrication matters, so that is why I kind of stay skeptical toward Synlube. Everything points to that it won't work, but if it didn't cost a mortgage payment to outfit a vehicle with all of their fluids, I would give it a try for myself. That's why I wanted cold, hard facts and figures first.
I guess that I'm just old fashioned that way.
To continue, I guess that we might be going about condemning Synlube's product this way based on cost, or that we have been programmed to believe that a product that could possibly last that long, without changing, couldn't possibly be true or work.
I have learned the very hard way to listen to the more experienced than I in most lubrication matters, so that is why I kind of stay skeptical toward Synlube. Everything points to that it won't work, but if it didn't cost a mortgage payment to outfit a vehicle with all of their fluids, I would give it a try for myself. That's why I wanted cold, hard facts and figures first.
I guess that I'm just old fashioned that way.
DAD2LEIA: OK, you make a good point but let's also consider that there aren't very many "experts" on SynLube. Using solid lubricants is relatively new to most people, even those who have been using and studying lubricants for years have little experience with colloids. Consequently, you really can't depend too heavily on others in order to make a determination.
In the end, you simply have to be willing to take a chance just as you did with the product you're using now. Do the homework, read their website and ask yourself the question: Why WOULDN'T it work?
In the end, you simply have to be willing to take a chance just as you did with the product you're using now. Do the homework, read their website and ask yourself the question: Why WOULDN'T it work?
glseve, I guess there are just not enough people out there to generate enough interst in getting a uoa. I though this forum was a place you could trade info and ideas without going to a web site. That way you could get info based on analysis and experience vs a sales promotion. I have never said that I though Synlube was anything good or bad, just that it was a mystry. And since there is not much info maybe it's just a product that will just go away, somewhere. Look at these 9 pages of interest, and still no rabbit.
I will be submitting a UOA. I told you that.
BTW, it's mystery, not mystry.
BTW, it's mystery, not mystry.
Bakerman I don't believe that those who are using it are aware that such a debate exist about the product. My point was to net out the sales promotion and enlist those on the website to obtain a UOA and see if there vehicles are running optimally.
However I believe that some of these people will not get that granular regarding information about there vehicles, we on this forum are for a lack of a better word "oil fanatics" looking for the best so we can extend the life of our vehicles and lower the total cost of ownership. Getting the most bang for the buck.
What I find of interest that some users of synlube have allowed for there email contacts to be posted which lends itself for nicely for exhanging information and insight if we continue to be the skeptics that we are about this product, then by all means lets leverage this resource to our advantage in the light of information gathering and make inquires of them.
Isn't this the process we use in everyday life we inquire research inquire more seek knowledge and then test whether such claims are true.
However I believe that some of these people will not get that granular regarding information about there vehicles, we on this forum are for a lack of a better word "oil fanatics" looking for the best so we can extend the life of our vehicles and lower the total cost of ownership. Getting the most bang for the buck.
What I find of interest that some users of synlube have allowed for there email contacts to be posted which lends itself for nicely for exhanging information and insight if we continue to be the skeptics that we are about this product, then by all means lets leverage this resource to our advantage in the light of information gathering and make inquires of them.
Isn't this the process we use in everyday life we inquire research inquire more seek knowledge and then test whether such claims are true.
If this thread goes on long enough, will we see a uoa or voa on this stuff. Testimonals are hard to figure out. Analysis and numbers are more useful, expecially if this oil is different than everything else in the world. It's like the caveman that says that with his secret weapon that no one else has, he can rule the world, and holds up a rock.
Houckster, a great reply to my skeptisism. Tell you what, I hang out in this thread and check out your UOA results when you post them. You may yet make the final case for this lubricant!
I've finally been able to draw samples for testing. One will go to SynLube, if that comes back OK, I'll send one to Dyson. Obviously, if I can't get a good UOA from SynLube, the second test makes no sense. If it is good, the second test will be necessary so the results will have validity in the eyes of others here.
That's very interesting. Will look forward to the results. How many miles/km on the sample?
quote:
Sift through the maze of non-scientific stuff and arrive at the lowest common denominator and you will see why AMSOIL is a highly respected company with an impecable record of satisfaction amongts it's customers!
Impeccable record of satisfaction huh ?
Well myself and some other people might just disagree with you on that .
Carry on though , never mind me .
A uoa from Terry would be more useful to all the uneducated around here.
About 15.3K.
Re Terry, I know that his word would have more value here but as I pointed out, I want to have Synlube's results first and then if that's good then I send another sample to Terry.
Re Terry, I know that his word would have more value here but as I pointed out, I want to have Synlube's results first and then if that's good then I send another sample to Terry.
