6467
Toyota Sludge V-6 Engine
Frank Miller co -inv
10/6/2001 10:59:36 AM
This problem is not isolated to just the Toyota V-6, it effects BMW, Chrysler, Lexus
it's not caused by oil and oil can't fix the problem.Don't use solvents to try and clean sludge, we have reports of engine seizing up, internal seal failures.www.auto-rx.com
6474
RE: Toyota Sludge V-6 Engine
10/9/2001 12:15:23 AM
What then Frank, is the cause of this very common Toyota problem?
6561
RE: RE: Toyota Sludge V-6 Engine
james taylor
10/2001 8:16:30 PM
i dont know
9185
RE: RE: RE: Toyota Sludge V-6 Engine
Charlene Blake
3/18/2003 2:09:37 PM
As owners continue to contact me in frustration about the current ENGINE OIL SLUDGE customer support program at Toyota, I see some interesting trends. I am wondering if others can come forward to confirm.
First, there is a NATIONAL backorder of pistons and piston rings used in the sludge repair program. I have noted that one owner had to wait SIX WEEKS for these parts to come in. Another owner was told by her service manager that there is a "problem with getting supplies....the piston rings are on backorder."
This begs the question....WHY, if there are so few sludge victims out there, are the parts not available. I recall when Iwas involved in the Chrysler ABS defect debacle that the ABS parts were also on NATIONAL BACKORDER for months. Is Toyota actually being overwhelmed with repair need? Are these part delays directly related to the incidence of sludge cases? Perhaps some technicians will comment?
Now, what about the fouling of the emissions control components? Why are so many OXYGEN SENSORS going bad? Don't these components affect the air/fuel ratio in the vehicle? Why are CATALYTIC CONVERTERS going bad after sludge repairs? Why is it that so many fuel system related components are being replaced just before the onset of sludge? Spark plug are fouling. Owners report misfiring and poor engine performance. Some owners are reporting failed state emissions tests.
I have noted in the past the trend in sludge occurrence based on model year. I have noted that the 2000 vehicle...Sienna, Camry, etc., seems to be showing the earliest sludge. Are these owners just even worse at maintaining their vehicles, do you think? I think that notion is absurd! The 1999 model are showing the sludge around 36,000-40,000miles. The 2000 models show it much sooner.....25,000-36,000 miles. There are scores of vehicles which had the problem at UNDER 20,000 miles on the vehicle. This refutes Mike Michels', spokesperson at Toyota, claim that owners are not changing their oil for 20,000-30,000 miles! What a joke! He is the same fellow who says that Toyota is "unaware of engine oil sludge in vehicles which have been properly maintained."
There are a some owners who had sludge develop in their Sienna vehices within the first year of ownership and with less than 15,000 miles on the vehicle. Tell me what Mr. Michels has to say about those cases!
I see a trend on oil analysis for a greatly reduced initial oil viscosity even with less than 1,600 miles on the engine oil. When the engine oil gets closer to the outside limit of the owner's manual recommended oil change interval, the oil shows maximum nitration and almost equal oxidation. The oil is out of grade. It is essentially TOO THIN. Is this the precursor to SLUDGE development? Is there great heat and engine wear as the oil loses its lubrication effectiveness so early in the life of the oil????? Is the resulting high heat effectively COOKING THE OIL within?
An EXXON lubrication specialist mentioned "cold spots" where the acids can accumulate. Is there such an area within the oil passages of these vehicles? If so, would it first appear as VARNISH and baked on oil and later as SLUDGE if the condition is not corrected? Where might this varnish first appear? What would it look like?
Please, technicians and oil specialists, please chime in. We need a good, analytical discussion as we had a Edmund's before I the discussion was abruptly CLOSED.
Let's examine the recent reports of engine compartment fires after the affected engines throw a rod through the block. First of all, is it the thick sludge or even the precursor condition of reduced viscosity, fuel-contamined oil that results in the engine rod being thrown? THEN, what apsect of this condition would cause a CATASTROPHIC FIRE in the engine compartment? I have recently read such reports and I would like to know the connection.
Thank you for your CONSTRUCTIVE addition to this discussion from a technical, and analytical perspective. If you choose to use personal attacks in this discussion, I will forward them to the site maintainer for removal. Opposing technical views are welcome.
Charlene Blake
cblake@erols.com
9186
RE: RE: Toyota Sludge V-6 Engine
Charlene Blake
3/18/2003 2:10:04 PM
As owners continue to contact me in frustration about the current ENGINE OIL SLUDGE customer support program at Toyota, I see some interesting trends. I am wondering if others can come forward to confirm.
First, there is a NATIONAL backorder of pistons and piston rings used in the sludge repair program. I have noted that one owner had to wait SIX WEEKS for these parts to come in. Another owner was told by her service manager that there is a "problem with getting supplies....the piston rings are on backorder."
This begs the question....WHY, if there are so few sludge victims out there, are the parts not available. I recall when Iwas involved in the Chrysler ABS defect debacle that the ABS parts were also on NATIONAL BACKORDER for months. Is Toyota actually being overwhelmed with repair need? Are these part delays directly related to the incidence of sludge cases? Perhaps some technicians will comment?
Now, what about the fouling of the emissions control components? Why are so many OXYGEN SENSORS going bad? Don't these components affect the air/fuel ratio in the vehicle? Why are CATALYTIC CONVERTERS going bad after sludge repairs? Why is it that so many fuel system related components are being replaced just before the onset of sludge? Spark plug are fouling. Owners report misfiring and poor engine performance. Some owners are reporting failed state emissions tests.
I have noted in the past the trend in sludge occurrence based on model year. I have noted that the 2000 vehicle...Sienna, Camry, etc., seems to be showing the earliest sludge. Are these owners just even worse at maintaining their vehicles, do you think? I think that notion is absurd! The 1999 model are showing the sludge around 36,000-40,000miles. The 2000 models show it much sooner.....25,000-36,000 miles. There are scores of vehicles which had the problem at UNDER 20,000 miles on the vehicle. This refutes Mike Michels', spokesperson at Toyota, claim that owners are not changing their oil for 20,000-30,000 miles! What a joke! He is the same fellow who says that Toyota is "unaware of engine oil sludge in vehicles which have been properly maintained."
There are a some owners who had sludge develop in their Sienna vehices within the first year of ownership and with less than 15,000 miles on the vehicle. Tell me what Mr. Michels has to say about those cases!
I see a trend on oil analysis for a greatly reduced initial oil viscosity even with less than 1,600 miles on the engine oil. When the engine oil gets closer to the outside limit of the owner's manual recommended oil change interval, the oil shows maximum nitration and almost equal oxidation. The oil is out of grade. It is essentially TOO THIN. Is this the precursor to SLUDGE development? Is there great heat and engine wear as the oil loses its lubrication effectiveness so early in the life of the oil????? Is the resulting high heat effectively COOKING THE OIL within?
An EXXON lubrication specialist mentioned "cold spots" where the acids can accumulate. Is there such an area within the oil passages of these vehicles? If so, would it first appear as VARNISH and baked on oil and later as SLUDGE if the condition is not corrected? Where might this varnish first appear? What would it look like?
Please, technicians and oil specialists, please chime in. We need a good, analytical discussion as we had a Edmund's before I the discussion was abruptly CLOSED.
Let's examine the recent reports of engine compartment fires after the affected engines throw a rod through the block. First of all, is it the thick sludge or even the precursor condition of reduced viscosity, fuel-contamined oil that results in the engine rod being thrown? THEN, what apsect of this condition would cause a CATASTROPHIC FIRE in the engine compartment? I have recently read such reports and I would like to know the connection.
Thank you for your CONSTRUCTIVE addition to this discussion from a technical, and analytical perspective. If you choose to use personal attacks in this discussion, I will forward them to the site maintainer for removal. Opposing technical views are welcome.
Charlene Blake
cblake@erols.com
9187
RE: Toyota Sludge V-6 Engine
Charlene Blake
3/18/2003 2:10:22 PM
As owners continue to contact me in frustration about the current ENGINE OIL SLUDGE customer support program at Toyota, I see some interesting trends. I am wondering if others can come forward to confirm.
First, there is a NATIONAL backorder of pistons and piston rings used in the sludge repair program. I have noted that one owner had to wait SIX WEEKS for these parts to come in. Another owner was told by her service manager that there is a "problem with getting supplies....the piston rings are on backorder."
This begs the question....WHY, if there are so few sludge victims out there, are the parts not available. I recall when Iwas involved in the Chrysler ABS defect debacle that the ABS parts were also on NATIONAL BACKORDER for months. Is Toyota actually being overwhelmed with repair need? Are these part delays directly related to the incidence of sludge cases? Perhaps some technicians will comment?
Now, what about the fouling of the emissions control components? Why are so many OXYGEN SENSORS going bad? Don't these components affect the air/fuel ratio in the vehicle? Why are CATALYTIC CONVERTERS going bad after sludge repairs? Why is it that so many fuel system related components are being replaced just before the onset of sludge? Spark plug are fouling. Owners report misfiring and poor engine performance. Some owners are reporting failed state emissions tests.
I have noted in the past the trend in sludge occurrence based on model year. I have noted that the 2000 vehicle...Sienna, Camry, etc., seems to be showing the earliest sludge. Are these owners just even worse at maintaining their vehicles, do you think? I think that notion is absurd! The 1999 model are showing the sludge around 36,000-40,000miles. The 2000 models show it much sooner.....25,000-36,000 miles. There are scores of vehicles which had the problem at UNDER 20,000 miles on the vehicle. This refutes Mike Michels', spokesperson at Toyota, claim that owners are not changing their oil for 20,000-30,000 miles! What a joke! He is the same fellow who says that Toyota is "unaware of engine oil sludge in vehicles which have been properly maintained."
There are a some owners who had sludge develop in their Sienna vehices within the first year of ownership and with less than 15,000 miles on the vehicle. Tell me what Mr. Michels has to say about those cases!
I see a trend on oil analysis for a greatly reduced initial oil viscosity even with less than 1,600 miles on the engine oil. When the engine oil gets closer to the outside limit of the owner's manual recommended oil change interval, the oil shows maximum nitration and almost equal oxidation. The oil is out of grade. It is essentially TOO THIN. Is this the precursor to SLUDGE development? Is there great heat and engine wear as the oil loses its lubrication effectiveness so early in the life of the oil????? Is the resulting high heat effectively COOKING THE OIL within?
An EXXON lubrication specialist mentioned "cold spots" where the acids can accumulate. Is there such an area within the oil passages of these vehicles? If so, would it first appear as VARNISH and baked on oil and later as SLUDGE if the condition is not corrected? Where might this varnish first appear? What would it look like?
Please, technicians and oil specialists, please chime in. We need a good, analytical discussion as we had a Edmund's before I the discussion was abruptly CLOSED.
Let's examine the recent reports of engine compartment fires after the affected engines throw a rod through the block. First of all, is it the thick sludge or even the precursor condition of reduced viscosity, fuel-contamined oil that results in the engine rod being thrown? THEN, what apsect of this condition would cause a CATASTROPHIC FIRE in the engine compartment? I have recently read such reports and I would like to know the connection.
Thank you for your CONSTRUCTIVE addition to this discussion from a technical, and analytical perspective. If you choose to use personal attacks in this discussion, I will forward them to the site maintainer for removal. Opposing technical views are welcome.
Charlene Blake
cblake@erols.com
10859
Toyota Sludge V-6 Engine
Bob Calvary
12/8/2003 1:02:29 PM
I have a 2001 Camry LE 3.0 with 48,000 miles on it. I have ALWAYS changed the oil at 3,000 miles. 3 days ago I had drained the oil and when I started to pour the new oil into the motor I noticed a hard crusty film about 1/16" to 3/32" thick inside the valve cover oil opening. I scrapped it off and was careful not to let any get into the engine but the space where the oil flows into the engine was restricted so much that the oil drained slowly. I was sure it was part of the sludge problem but after seeing the valve cover removed (by Toyota) it looked like a new engine with my own eyes I wanted to let others know what the tech said. Where you pour the oil into the car is slightly cupped and a small amount of oil can't get into the engine so it sets there and cooks with the high temperature and forms the carbon crust. This will not hurt the engine because it is separated. I was please to find I didn't have the sludge problem but I want to let others know so they will not make the same mistake I did. bcalvary@tampabay.rr.com
11017
RE: Toyota Sludge V-6 Engine
John Petty
1/3/2004 11:04:42 AM
We have a 2000 Sienna that had sludge problems and Toyota fixed the engine. But just 30,000 miles later the engine blows and they tell me that a piston broke and that that sometimes just happens. They also said that they did not replace any parts in the engine but just cleaned it out. Could the sludge from before caused that. No engine light ever came on. The only indicator was the oil light for a few miles. When it came on I pulled over and checked the oil and it was perfect. We have reciepts for every oil change and it was done regular.
11025
RE: Toyota Sludge V-6 Engine
Kevin Chinery
1/5/2004 5:38:08 PM
MY 99 Camry just blew its engine, regular oil changes and only 51K miles on it!
"Toyota Owners Unite for Resolution"
http://www.petitiononline.com/TMC2003/petition.html[This message was edited by Charlene Blake on Tue March 16 2004 at 10:49 PM.]
"Toyota Owners Unite for Resolution"
