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Read our primer articles on High Mileage Oil, Synthetic Oil and Kinematic Viscosity

Cellulose media has a wide variance in pour distribution. The synthetic medias ..especially the Nanofiber and SYNTEQ processes merely spin/spray a web of filaments that provide depth. Enough filaments, higher numbers/longer life.

You can't look at filter life in terms of miles. It's always in terms of the filter material it sees. That's MAINLY dictated by the warm up fuel enriched miles. The rest warmed up miles will be loaded at a MUCH lower rate with oxidized components that will fatigue.

So, just about any filter will go 15k at some variable level of filtration. The GM OLM doesn't say "If your OLM tells you to change the oil @ 12k, you are too late and should have known to buy ONLY an EAO or PureOne, or M1 filter. Silly consumer". No, it's pegging the filter life to the oil life on the high end.

Filter fatigue and oil fatigue don't plot the same curves, at least always. Once you get above a certain mileage per interval, the loading due to insolubles makes the other mileage MOSTLY invisible.

I've tested PureOne's with 9k on them and at cold start, with heavy oil and the oil pump in relief, there was elevated PSID across it. It was transitional with the retreat of the pump relief event. This happens with any filter, even brand new.
Doesn't a filter spend a good part of its life in bi-pass? What happens when an engine is stone cold pushing 60-80 psi of oil pressure? How about 45 psi cruising at 70 on the highway? Is the oil getting filtered at all? We had this discussion at work a few days ago and a mechanic posed that question and left a few of us scratching our heads. I don't think the filter plays as important a role as most people think.

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So the highly flow restrictive PureONE failed at only 5,000 miles/six months and has no media reinforcement? Seems like Purolator's 3,000 mile/3 month recommendation should have been followed in this case. So for my 4 vehicles, driving conditions and following Purolator's and my vehicle oil change recommendations, I should use 20 PureONES a year instead of 4 AMSOIL EaO filters? No thanks...
I wouldn't write the P1 filter off just yet. P1 vs. EaO filters, my guess is for every EaO filter sold Purolator probably sells 1,000 filters. My point is a bad filter could have gotten by. I'm sure there are bad EaO filters too. Things happen, Toyota gas pedal recall ring a bell? Up until recently Toyota was highly respected.

As a side bar- Amsoil had issues with the EaO on Toyota vehicles.

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quote:
Originally posted by ADFD1:
I wouldn't write the P1 filter off just yet. P1 vs. EaO filters, my guess is for every EaO filter sold Purolator probably sells 1,000 filters. My point is a bad filter could have gotten by. I'm sure there are bad EaO filters too.
Maybe. I've sold thousands of EaO. Haven't heard of a bad one yet. Besides, if I have to buy and install 20 PureONE filters instead of 4 AMSOIL EaO's, that alone writes them off my list.

quote:
As a side bar- Amsoil had issues with the EaO on Toyota vehicles.

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The only issue AMSOIL has is they recommend following the new required oil filter change intervals to be covered under the Toyota extended warranty for the sludge prone engines, instead of the 25,000 mile/1 year recommendation. AMSOIL recommends the Mann filter for up to 7500 miles to save the consumer money and to meet the new Toyota oil filter change interval warranty requirements.
Last edited by timvipond
I guess you're an Amsoil dealer? They make some fine products. My father and uncle are mechanics, used 1000's of Pure One filters, cut open their fair share of them too. No problems. For 1 year or 12,000 mile OCI's a Pure One or Mobil 1 filter would be up to the task, and probably trap more dirt than one EaO filter. We can respectfully have different views. Either way it would be tough to prove. JMO

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quote:
Originally posted by ADFD1:
I wouldn't write the P1 filter off just yet. P1 vs. EaO filters, my guess is for every EaO filter sold Purolator probably sells 1,000 filters. My point is a bad filter could have gotten by. I'm sure there are bad EaO filters too. Things happen, Toyota gas pedal recall ring a bell? Up until recently Toyota was highly respected.

As a side bar- Amsoil had issues with the EaO on Toyota vehicles.

AD



I wrote the P1 off a long time ago. That's why I use the AMSOIL,..or the bosch distance which is basically an improved P1. I will also use the fram x2(10k filter) on occasion because it won't clog like the P1.

My top choices being amsoil,bosch distance, fleetguard stratapore,and m1 made by champion.

Advance auto or auto zone now sells the bosh distance. Cost is about $12 or $13 and well worth it.

The P1 is too restrictive,clogs too often, and bypasses. A $6 waste if you ask me and not worth the risk.
quote:
Originally posted by ADFD1:
I guess you're an Amsoil dealer? They make some fine products. My father and uncle are mechanics, used 1000's of Pure One filters, cut open their fair share of them too. No problems. For 1 year or 12,000 mile OCI's a Pure One or Mobil 1 filter would be up to the task, and probably trap more dirt than one EaO filter. We can respectfully have different views. Either way it would be tough to prove. JMO

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You're missing the point with the amsoil filter. The question you have to ask is what is it doing at it's half life. Simple,it is filtering far better than the P1 overall....removing more dirt,smaller dirt particulates and with much less restriction across the media.

If you had for example....two cars side by side each driven say 150k. One with the P1 and the other with the EA amsoil filter changed at between 15k and 25k vs the pure one filter changed more often......

The engine with the amsoil depth filter would see less wear over the long haul and that is the ultimate goal in the first place.

  
Who wants to keep changing filters constantly if you don't need to? Why use a restrictive filter??

Remember,the P1 is not a depth filter...that's the issue.....it has to be changed much more often because it clogs,resticts,and bypasses.

The best choice is always the depth filter with the backing support screen because it works far better over the long haul and doesn't bypass nearly as often. Ever cut one open?

There simply is no contest about which filter is better!


quote:
1000's of P1 filters. Who's the dealer now!!
Last edited by captainkirk
IMO the Amsoil filter is trapping less dirt up until its half life, possibly letting twice the smaller particles through early on. Then when it starts to load up it starts to filter more efficiently, but it took half its life to get there. You're only talking about changing the Pure One filter twice in 25,000 miles, and the cost of the two filters is still less than one Amsoil filter.

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quote:
Originally posted by ADFD1:
IMO the Amsoil filter is trapping less dirt up until its half life, possibly letting twice the smaller particles through early on. Then when it starts to load up it starts to filter more efficiently, but it took half its life to get there.
Isn't this basically true for any filter? Filters become more efficient up until they go into bypass. If I had to use 5 PureONE filters, this would happen 5 times compared to once with the AMSOIL EaO.
quote:
You're only talking about changing the Pure One filter twice in 25,000 miles, and the cost of the two filters is still less than one Amsoil filter.
For my vehicles (and many other vehicles that do towing, dirt roads, short trips, idling, etc), I would have to change 5 PureONES for every AMSOIL EaO to meet my vehicle, PureOne's and AMSOIL's recommendations. The poor guy with the Honda had very little filtration when the PureONE failed after only 5,000 miles (it could have happened much sooner). I just don't see how a PureONE oil restrictive, microfiber media without support that lasts 1/5th as long as a nanofiber, less restrictive, media supported filter, is the better filter.
Last edited by timvipond
quote:
Originally posted by ADFD1:
IMO the Amsoil filter is trapping less dirt up until its half life, possibly letting twice the smaller particles through early on. Then when it starts to load up it starts to filter more efficiently, but it took half its life to get there. You're only talking about changing the Pure One filter twice in 25,000 miles, and the cost of the two filters is still less than one Amsoil filter.

AD


I never said the amsoil filter was letting more dirt through up until half life. I said to imagine just how much better at the half life. If I'm not mistaken,..filter efficiency is based on half life or something along those lines.

It has been proven industry wide that changing any filter, oil,fuel,air,etc. too often too soon is actually a detriment to the efficiency of the filter. It causes more wear,not less.

Even when new,...the difference between the amsoil and the P1 related to initial particle size is basically splitting hairs....With the exception being that the P1 is more restrictive even when new.

The amsoil filter gets better long before it's half life,and is at a very high standard when new,it's been proven. Someone on bitog ran a test to back that as I recall.

If you are that concerned/paranoid about particulates....then I would recommend you put your fears to rest and install a bypass filtration system. It will filter done to One micron or better in some cases.

By installing a good synthetic oil and using a good depth filter.....just how long do you think your engine will last. You will probably never wear it out. The car will fall apart around the engine. How many cars are junked with still running engines?

The depth filter makes the most practical and economic sense and does an amazing job at keeping the oil very clean with extended OCI..... including from the start of the oil change.
I think we might agree here. With all the time filters spend in Bi-pass engines last a very long time, for the guy that keeps a car to 200,000 miles any filter will do. Odds are the car will shake itself apart and rot before the engine fails.

You say & I agree.

Quote:If you are that concerned/paranoid about particulates....then I would recommend you put your fears to rest and install a bypass filtration system. It will filter done to One micron or better in some cases.

By installing a good synthetic oil and using a good depth filter.....just how long do you think your engine will last. You will probably never wear it out. The car will fall apart around the engine. How many cars are junked with still running engines?

____________________________________

Tim there was a thread running on Bitog about a poor guy running an Amsoil filter in a Toyota engine that failed. % wise the one P1 failure is tiny for all the Purolator filters in use. We should be seeing junkyards teaming with destroyed engines from P1 filters, not so.
quote:

Tim there was a thread running on Bitog about a poor guy running an Amsoil filter in a Toyota engine that failed. % wise the one P1 failure is tiny for all the Purolator filters in use. We should be seeing junkyards teaming with destroyed engines from P1 filters, not so.
Do you have a link?

The one Pablo posted a link to was a 2004 Honda Element. These are known to be very easy on oil filters, and only recommend filter changes every other oil change. I'm not sure there is a vehicle made that is easier on oil filters.

There have only been a few P1 filters opened at Bitog, and this one of those failed at or before 5,000 miles, so we don't know the failure is tiny. In fact, based on those opened, it seems quite high. He didn't know it failed until he opened it. Since it is a highly restrictive filter with no media support, I'm not too surprised of the failure. And not sure a torn filter media would destroy an engine as his was still running, but likely has increased wear. I don't see how this filter is better than the EaO in design, construction, performance or longevity.
Last edited by timvipond
Hello Tim,

Let me first say everything I read on the WWW is taken under advisement. I like Amsoil, but they do spend a lot of money promoting their product, and a lot of their claims I also take under advisement, with an open mind.

Here is the Amsoil / Toyota thread. As you can see people attacked and defended Amsoil, casting some doubt.

http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/...=1819180#Post1819180



This thread is interesting showing Fram as one of the best filters for Flow. We know the deal with Fram. Truth is after reading through most of the the thread it seemed, at least to me that they never perfected the test. But still a lot of time and effort went into it.

http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/...Number=314996&page=1

Cheers!

AD
Amusing little "how many angels can dance on the head of a pin" exercise, but are you guys aware that you're talking about passenger car engine filtration? It's not exactly a GE Frame 7FA. This is like the letters to Dear Abby where I find myself asking "Is that really the biggest problem you have? Can we trade lives?"

It's such a low severity application that really any filter you pull off of the shelf with the right gasket diameter & thread size will serve. There are guys who go to Home Depot & buy $200 worm-drive saws when all they are going to do is cut a coupla-three 2x4s. Is that saw "better" than a $50 Black & Decker? You can make that argument based on specs, but in this case paying 4x the price does not provide 4x the value.

I call it "Tim Allen Syndrome". You're all assuming that the highest level of overkill is called for in every application. A fool & his money are soon parted. The smart money tries to find the sweet spot.
quote:
Originally posted by ADFD1:
Hello Tim,

Let me first say everything I read on the WWW is taken under advisement. I like Amsoil, but they do spend a lot of money promoting their product, and a lot of their claims I also take under advisement, with an open mind.

Here is the Amsoil / Toyota thread. As you can see people attacked and defended Amsoil, casting some doubt.

http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/...=1819180#Post1819180

Thanks for the link.

Inside that link was another to the original poster's remarks from another website. Seems like he only contacted the dealer that sold him the filter, and not AMSOIL. Had he contacted AMSOIL, they would have had him submit a claim, and ship the filter and oil to AMSOIL for evaluation. The only "evidence" that the filter clogged and caused the problem was a remark from the Toyota dealership, who I doubt did a thorough investigation of the actual cause. If AMSOIL thought the filter could have caused the problem, they would have immediately paid for parts and repairs. If later, AMSOIL can prove the filter did not cause the problem, they would seek reimbursement from Toyota.

Also, a dealership can not deny warranty claims. Only the manufacturer can do that. And the reason has to be stated in writing, which I did not find.
Last edited by timvipond
Like I said internet stories are always taken under advisement. I'm not sure how Amsoil would have handled it, my gut tells me it would have been a volleyball game, bouncing blame back and forth, which is typical in the automotive business. But then again I have no experience with Amsoil or Toyota so it is just gut feeling.
quote:
Originally posted by ADFD1:
Like I said internet stories are always taken under advisement. I'm not sure how Amsoil would have handled it, my gut tells me it would have been a volleyball game, bouncing blame back and forth, which is typical in the automotive business. But then again I have no experience with Amsoil or Toyota so it is just gut feeling.
I think you shouldn't listen to your gut in this case. Listen to the facts and history. AMSOIL has handled several claims in 38 years and it is done as I described. No bouncing back and forth. No long drawn out battles. Handled very quickly. When in doubt, AMSOIL pays and later seeks reimbursement when they can prove their products did not fail.

PureONES are good filters. I just don't believe they are better than the EaOs.
Last edited by timvipond
quote:
Originally posted by Pablo:
Yes filters do go into by-pass - another argument against overly viscous oils. Some folks on BITOG years back thought of OF's as failed parts sieves. Only there to catch junk - after the failure. There is some logic in this camp.

As for P1 - people seem to defend this OF as strongly as some other top brands. This one looks marginal:

P1 pics


There goes Pablo the Amsoil salesman again showing us a Pure One Pic and saying its marginal. How do you arrive at this conclusion that the pics are marginal, are you an Oil Filter Expert.

What exactly is your AGENDA here on Noria, and since you are an Amsoil Salesman I do not think we can buy anything you are saying.

If someone posted a pic of an Amsoil EaO Oil Filter you would probably say it looks GREAT.
quote:
Originally posted by Tim Vipond:
quote:
Originally posted by ADFD1:
Like I said internet stories are always taken under advisement. I'm not sure how Amsoil would have handled it, my gut tells me it would have been a volleyball game, bouncing blame back and forth, which is typical in the automotive business. But then again I have no experience with Amsoil or Toyota so it is just gut feeling.
I think you shouldn't listen to your gut in this case. Listen to the facts and history. AMSOIL has handled several claims in 38 years and it is done as I described. No bouncing back and forth. No long drawn out battles. Handled very quickly. When in doubt, AMSOIL pays and later seeks reimbursement when they can prove their products did not fail.

PureONES are good filters. I just don't believe they are better than the EaOs.


Wow Amsoil must have some legal department and a lot of faith to pay out then seek reimbursement. It doesn't add up. I'm sure many a car has sat waiting for a decision if the repair cost was major. No one pays out w/o investigation and trying to defend their product.

AD
quote:
Originally posted by ADFD1:
quote:
Originally posted by Tim Vipond:
quote:
Originally posted by ADFD1:
Like I said internet stories are always taken under advisement. I'm not sure how Amsoil would have handled it, my gut tells me it would have been a volleyball game, bouncing blame back and forth, which is typical in the automotive business. But then again I have no experience with Amsoil or Toyota so it is just gut feeling.
I think you shouldn't listen to your gut in this case. Listen to the facts and history. AMSOIL has handled several claims in 38 years and it is done as I described. No bouncing back and forth. No long drawn out battles. Handled very quickly. When in doubt, AMSOIL pays and later seeks reimbursement when they can prove their products did not fail.

PureONES are good filters. I just don't believe they are better than the EaOs.


Wow Amsoil must have some legal department and a lot of faith to pay out then seek reimbursement.
They do.
quote:
It doesn't add up.
Sure it does. Great service + great products + great reputation = great sales. AMSOIL set sales records last year while the motor oil industry suffered a 20% decrease.
quote:
I'm sure many a car has sat waiting for a decision if the repair cost was major. No one pays out w/o investigation and trying to defend their product.
If you are sure, you must have proof. Please provide.
quote:
Originally posted by Big Bear:
quote:
Originally posted by Pablo:
Yes filters do go into by-pass - another argument against overly viscous oils. Some folks on BITOG years back thought of OF's as failed parts sieves. Only there to catch junk - after the failure. There is some logic in this camp.

As for P1 - people seem to defend this OF as strongly as some other top brands. This one looks marginal:

P1 pics


There goes Pablo the Amsoil salesman again showing us a Pure One Pic and saying its marginal. How do you arrive at this conclusion that the pics are marginal, are you an Oil Filter Expert.

What exactly is your AGENDA here on Noria, and since you are an Amsoil Salesman I do not think we can buy anything you are saying.

If someone posted a pic of an Amsoil EaO Oil Filter you would probably say it looks GREAT.


My agenda = the truth
Your agenda = attacking me with almost every one of your posts, anyone with 1/2 brain can see that.

Did you even look closely at the pictures?
quote:
Originally posted by Tim Vipond:
quote:
Originally posted by ADFD1:
quote:
Originally posted by Tim Vipond:
quote:
Originally posted by ADFD1:
Like I said internet stories are always taken under advisement. I'm not sure how Amsoil would have handled it, my gut tells me it would have been a volleyball game, bouncing blame back and forth, which is typical in the automotive business. But then again I have no experience with Amsoil or Toyota so it is just gut feeling.
I think you shouldn't listen to your gut in this case. Listen to the facts and history. AMSOIL has handled several claims in 38 years and it is done as I described. No bouncing back and forth. No long drawn out battles. Handled very quickly. When in doubt, AMSOIL pays and later seeks reimbursement when they can prove their products did not fail.

PureONES are good filters. I just don't believe they are better than the EaOs.


Wow Amsoil must have some legal department and a lot of faith to pay out then seek reimbursement.
They do.
quote:
It doesn't add up.
Sure it does. Great service + great products + great reputation = great sales. AMSOIL set sales records last year while the motor oil industry suffered a 20% decrease.
quote:
I'm sure many a car has sat waiting for a decision if the repair cost was major. No one pays out w/o investigation and trying to defend their product.
If you are sure, you must have proof. Please provide.


How about you prove it? I mean the part where they first pay out then go after the party at fault.

AD
quote:
Originally posted by Pablo:
quote:
Originally posted by Big Bear:
quote:
Originally posted by Pablo:
Yes filters do go into by-pass - another argument against overly viscous oils. Some folks on BITOG years back thought of OF's as failed parts sieves. Only there to catch junk - after the failure. There is some logic in this camp.

As for P1 - people seem to defend this OF as strongly as some other top brands. This one looks marginal:

P1 pics


There goes Pablo the Amsoil salesman again showing us a Pure One Pic and saying its marginal. How do you arrive at this conclusion that the pics are marginal, are you an Oil Filter Expert.

What exactly is your AGENDA here on Noria, and since you are an Amsoil Salesman I do not think we can buy anything you are saying.

If someone posted a pic of an Amsoil EaO Oil Filter you would probably say it looks GREAT.


My agenda = the truth
Your agenda = attacking me with almost every one of your posts, anyone with 1/2 brain can see that.

Did you even look closely at the pictures?


Pablo, you are even loosing credibility on BITOG.

My agenda = Exposing Pablo
Your Agenda= Pushing Amsoil Products.
quote:
Originally posted by ADFD1:
quote:
Originally posted by Tim Vipond:
quote:
Originally posted by ADFD1:
quote:
Originally posted by Tim Vipond:
quote:
Originally posted by ADFD1:
Like I said internet stories are always taken under advisement. I'm not sure how Amsoil would have handled it, my gut tells me it would have been a volleyball game, bouncing blame back and forth, which is typical in the automotive business. But then again I have no experience with Amsoil or Toyota so it is just gut feeling.
I think you shouldn't listen to your gut in this case. Listen to the facts and history. AMSOIL has handled several claims in 38 years and it is done as I described. No bouncing back and forth. No long drawn out battles. Handled very quickly. When in doubt, AMSOIL pays and later seeks reimbursement when they can prove their products did not fail.

PureONES are good filters. I just don't believe they are better than the EaOs.


Wow Amsoil must have some legal department and a lot of faith to pay out then seek reimbursement.
They do.
quote:
It doesn't add up.
Sure it does. Great service + great products + great reputation = great sales. AMSOIL set sales records last year while the motor oil industry suffered a 20% decrease.
quote:
I'm sure many a car has sat waiting for a decision if the repair cost was major. No one pays out w/o investigation and trying to defend their product.
If you are sure, you must have proof. Please provide.


How about you prove it? I mean the part where they first pay out then go after the party at fault. What happens with a hung jury? Who eats it?

AD
quote:
Originally posted by ADFD1:
quote:
Originally posted by ADFD1:
quote:
Originally posted by Tim Vipond:
quote:
Originally posted by ADFD1:
quote:
Originally posted by Tim Vipond:
quote:
Originally posted by ADFD1:
Like I said internet stories are always taken under advisement. I'm not sure how Amsoil would have handled it, my gut tells me it would have been a volleyball game, bouncing blame back and forth, which is typical in the automotive business. But then again I have no experience with Amsoil or Toyota so it is just gut feeling.
I think you shouldn't listen to your gut in this case. Listen to the facts and history. AMSOIL has handled several claims in 38 years and it is done as I described. No bouncing back and forth. No long drawn out battles. Handled very quickly. When in doubt, AMSOIL pays and later seeks reimbursement when they can prove their products did not fail.

PureONES are good filters. I just don't believe they are better than the EaOs.


Wow Amsoil must have some legal department and a lot of faith to pay out then seek reimbursement.
They do.
quote:
It doesn't add up.
Sure it does. Great service + great products + great reputation = great sales. AMSOIL set sales records last year while the motor oil industry suffered a 20% decrease.
quote:
I'm sure many a car has sat waiting for a decision if the repair cost was major. No one pays out w/o investigation and trying to defend their product.
If you are sure, you must have proof. Please provide.


How about you prove it? I mean the part where they first pay out then go after the party at fault. What happens with a hung jury? Who eats it?

AD
Certainly. From a "Lubes n Greases" article: http://www.performanceoiltechn...allarticle_aug05.pdf

"It was later deter-
mined that both paid claims were ulti-
mately the result of manufacturing errors
on behalf of a major automotive OEM.”

I've also read on a forum where a customer had a claim. It was handled quickly and paid for parts/labor, towing and rental car.

If AMSOIL can not determine their products were conclusively not at fault, they have paid anyway. Even if it fell into "grey areas".
quote:
Originally posted by Big Bear:

My agenda = Exposing Pablo
Your Agenda= Pushing Amsoil Products.


Strange.

You attack. You never provide proof or truth or data or facts. Exposing what? What am I hiding?

And what am I pushing here? I'm not selling. I jumped into the thread because it was crazy ridiculous on both sides.

Why do you have such a big boner for me?
Why do you go personal?
quote:
Originally posted by Pablo:
quote:
Originally posted by Big Bear:

My agenda = Exposing Pablo
Your Agenda= Pushing Amsoil Products.


Strange.

You attack. You never provide proof or truth or data or facts. Exposing what? What am I hiding?

And what am I pushing here? I'm not selling. I jumped into the thread because it was crazy ridiculous on both sides.

Why do you have such a big boner for me?
Why do you go personal?



Pablo, you are an Amsoil salesman so you are the one that needs to show us the proof why the Amsoil EaO Oil Filters are superior to the Pure Ones.

Myself and the other members here do not have to show you anything, we are potential customers and can decide to go down to Wal-Mart and buy an oil filter.

If you want to continue your rant and to take cheap shots at the Pure One Oil Filter, at least have the decency to call your boss at Amsoil and have him run some tests on your oil filter versus the Pure One just like you guys do the 4-Ball Wear Test with Amsoil Motor Oil versus other motor oil's. I am not going to buy some sales pitch from an Amsoil salesman, you want us to buy your Oil Filter, then show us some tests, you want our money, then you show us the proof.
I recall reading an Amsoil rep saying if you run enough tests you get the results you are looking for. I'm sure Amsoil ran tests to get results they were looking for with their filters, as well as their oil, as other co's do.

I think they make some good products, but slowly I'm losing respect for them. Too many reps pushing product is not good IMO for any company.

Just forwarded from a friend some data re: Pure One filters:


http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/...16457&Number=1619451


AD
Last edited by adfd1
quote:
Originally posted by Big Bear:
Pablo, you are an Amsoil salesman so you are the one that needs to show us the proof why the Amsoil EaO Oil Filters are superior to the Pure Ones.


I don't get this constant feedback that I'm an Amsoil dealer. Why do you keep doing this??? I've asked a bunch of times in an couple different ways and you never answer my question. It seems odd, that's all.

I never actually said EaO's are superior. If you can find where I said that, I would appreciate it. I am however, challenging the notion that P1's are in all ways superior to EaO's. I've seen it written, but I've seen no substantial data.

quote:
Originally posted by Big Bear:
Myself and the other members here do not have to show you anything, we are potential customers and can decide to go down to Wal-Mart and buy an oil filter.


I would think if you say P1 is better than EaO, it's just air unless you show some data. I don't really care, I just like to live by facts and truth, just as you try to, I'm sure. If you want to buy OF's at WalMart, it certainly doesn't bother me.

quote:
Originally posted by Big Bear:
If you want to continue your rant and to take cheap shots at the Pure One Oil Filter, at least have the decency to call your boss at Amsoil and have him run some tests on your oil filter versus the Pure One just like you guys do the 4-Ball Wear Test with Amsoil Motor Oil versus other motor oil's. I am not going to buy some sales pitch from an Amsoil salesman, you want us to buy your Oil Filter, then show us some tests, you want our money, then you show us the proof.


Rant? Please what rant? I have not ranted at all in this thread. Cheap shots? I see a lot of cheap shots at Amsoil in this thread, none at P1.

It's always the 4-ball test. What does that have to do with OF's? Can we consider this a cheap shot from you? No, I'm the one with all the cheap shots.

What sales pitch have I given? Where? When?

I don't think Amsoil will do much more comparison tests outside of ISO-4548-12, because I think they know any non-standard OF tests can give some very misleading results.

Thanks,

Paul
But over the years, so many guys have left the board over stuff like Pablo and Frank posting things that were 100% false- guys like Terry Dyson, the old Castrol spokesman- etc. Guys that contributed a lot of money towards this site, more money than Frank contributes from what I understand. I look around at the guys that were here four, five years ago that used to donate pretty heavily- nobody seems to do that anymore except for the newer guys. A BIG reason is the way Frank and some other senior members were allowed to get away with murder- and a lot of people took offense to it.


Pablo, this was a message I got from a member on BITOG, it seems your untruthful posts as well as Frank Miller's drove away a lot of members from BITOG, you even drove Terry Dyson away when he was posting about Biosyn, you are using this board as well as BITOG for your agenda of getting sales and your Cloak and Dagger Techniques as well as jumping into threads on BITOG that have nothing to do with Amsoil in order to cause doubt and chaos shows me that you do not care what is best for everyone, all you care about is getting another sale. You have the most posts on BITOG, I guess you want to get your name out there as well as having everyone see your Amsoil Logo.
quote:
I recall reading an Amsoil rep saying if you run enough tests you get the results you are looking for


It's called 'selective testing'. Lots of companies do it; it speaks to a remarkably clueless honesty to admit it. I only know of one company where it's considered a firing offense (and that company is obviouly not Amsoil, given that quote).
quote:
Originally posted by Pablo:
So you think I drove people away from BITOG? That's pretty good.

Terry and I are friends. I can assure you that he didn't leave because of me. It's just more "stuff" from you. Pretty much getting old, I just think you have some continued odd bent. I'm just not sure why.



So this is not just directed at Pablo or anyone who would question me( please do I have no axe or product to promote except my core oil analysis interpretation business!). I'd say my track record is a good one.

Pablo you questioned my recommending RL, LC, etc. and then seeing lower than stellar results from BITOG posted data; well guess what?.... chemistries, raw materials, and formulations change. Cars change, fuels change, the product that worked last year well may be sucking wind today. The only reason you have known most of that is that DYSON ANALYSIS shared it here or on NORIA etc. for nearly 10 years.

Add the fact that the data you see at BITOG is NOT ALWAYS COMPLETE OR COMPREHENSIVE because it either can't be shared or no one paid for it to be shared.

I am still in the game , marbles on the table.

Pablo and others, to date I have not been paid one thin dime for working for RLI yet but I hope too soon. Kids need shoes for school starting here!

Terry

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Pablo, so you and Terry are friends, you constantly slammed your friend over his association with Biosyn on the open board, if you really were Terry's friend you would have done everything in a PM, I am not buying what you are saying here about Terry.

I will Cut and Paste a Link so Noria members can see how good of a friend Pablo the Amsoil Salesman was with Terry Dyson.

http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/...Number=974210&page=1
Lots of people on these boards have agendas, that is becoming more and more obvious each and every day. You really dig around don't you bear?

Amsoil made it very easy for anyone who wants to make some extra scratch, especially in hard times. Don't get me wrong I like some of their products, but I think many of them are grossly over rated, and over priced.

AD
Bear - Terry and I have had our public differences. So what? I call them as I see them. NO ONE is perfect. I think I was right about RLI. I raised legitimate questions and one thread does not unmake a friendship.

What is your TRUE agenda? You accuse me of being sneaky and stuff. I rarely send PM's, mainly just respond. I'm right in the open. I guess that's a bad thing now.

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