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Read our primer articles on High Mileage Oil, Synthetic Oil and Kinematic Viscosity

quote:
Originally posted by Big Bear:
quote:
Here's Pennzoil's hybrid 0w-20 CCS/MRV spec's

MRV viscosity, cP (°C) ASTD D-4684 16,800 (-40)
CCS Viscosity, cP (°C ) ASTM D-5293 5,600 (-35)

Penzoil's Ultra 5w-20
MRV viscosity, cP(°C)ASTD D-4684 11,700 (-35)
CCS Viscosity, cP(°C)ASTM D-5293 4,250 (-35)

Here's Mobil's M1 0w-40 @ -40C (MRV only)
MRV at -40ºC 26242 cP



Captain Kirk, which of these oil's would you want in your car if you were in Northern Minnesota during the month of January where overnite lows can dip well below 0 Degrees.

Is it better to have a lower number in the D-4684 and D-5293 tests.


Now you know the answer to that. Simlube isn't on the list.
quote:
Originally posted by Big Bear:
quote:
quote:
Originally posted by Big Bear:Amsoil Motor Oil is just too THICK, especially for the NORTHERN folks during the wintertime.

No it isn't. Look at the Pour Point and Cold Cranking numbers. None better. Pick the 0w-XX and all will be well. AMSOIL is VERY popular in cold climates.

Show me where AMSOIL has ever failed to perform as advertised. No one else has.


Sorry, Tim, but I have seen the Cold Cranking Numbers and they do not look as good as my next oil that I will be using in the wintertime.
which Cold Cranking numbers are you talking about? Pennzoil 0w20 CCS Viscosity, cP (°C ) ASTM D-5293 5,600 (-35),AMSOIL 0w20 is only 4069. Pennzoil 0w20 is much thicker. No thanks.

quote:
Originally posted by Big Bear:Pour Point does not mean anything to me, what means something is the D-4684 test that Amsoil has failed to take part in, without that test I cannot even think of buying Amsoil Motor Oil, its a better test than the ASTM D-5293
Which D-4684 test results are you talking about? Please post the link. This test measures wax crystallization. Since the AMSOIL full chemical synthetic oils contain no wax, this would not be a valid test. This is why Pour Point and Cold Cranking values are used.

quote:
Originally posted by Big Bear:Show us the DATA that any of what we are saying is wrong, I have all of the numbers on just about all of the motor oil's and Amsoil is coming up thick and short.
You have to show me some data first. Again, AMSOIL meets all SAE viscosity standards they say they do and the oil has not failed in 38 years. Doesn't get any better than that.
Last edited by timvipond
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Big Bear:

Sorry, Tim, but I have seen the Cold Cranking Numbers and they do not look as good as my next oil that I will be using in the wintertime.

Bear. I see you live in NY. UPSTATE? How cold does it get,and what is a typical cold start for you. Do you heat the oil pan in the winter? Have you ever had cold start issues with any particular oil.

I once ran ran Amsoil 20w-50 in a 1986 regal with a 5.0 olds v8 and it started no problem at around 0 F many times. M1 10-30 would allow valve train rattle at 40 F.

CD-2 detergent allowed the M1 to go another 2k with no rattle/tap for a total of 4k. Amsoil never needed CD-2.
quote:
Originally posted by Trajan:


Now you know the answer to that. Simlube isn't on the list.



Trajan..........What is Simlube?

///// 2004 BMW Z4 3.0i sport/premium/convienence pkg. GC 0w30 or M1 0w-40. (TRAJANS FANTASY CAR/OIL)



I, on the other hand,unlike Trajan,use a product called Synlube lube-4-life.

I just drove the Mustang 4.0 V6 down the NJ parkway doing between 80-90 at 95F for a very extended run. I WOT'D the car at 83 and the V6 still had punch to push me back in the seat.......USING THE SYNLUBE LUBE-4-LIFE MOTOR OIL. It now has on the oil about 13K. Remember......the last car was traded with around 60k on said oil...............and never any issues.

The Car uses ZERO OIL.

Instead of spending time changing the oil,I utilized my free time and saved $$$, to go for a drive,dine in Cape May and check out the beach!

Did the same hard fast run back home. Zero oil use,plenty of punch even at over 80 in a V6!


IN SUM,TRAJAN............

Who cares about lists...........I go by P-E-R-F-O-R-M-A-N-C-E....


I don't need a stinking.........list!!!

GIRLIE MEN NEED LISTS!!!!!


TRAJAN........DO YOU NEED A LIST?


Captain Kirk
Last edited by captainkirk
quote:
which Cold Cranking numbers are you talking about? Pennzoil 0w20 CCS Viscosity, cP (°C ) ASTM D-5293 5,600 (-35),AMSOIL 0w20 is only 4069. Pennzoil 0w20 is much thicker. No thanks.


Amsoil 0W-20 4069 @ -35

Castrol Edge 0W-20 3860 @ -35

Tim, I do not want to hear nor do I care about Castrol's Warranty or Amsoil's Warranty, nor do I care about Amsoil's 38 year history, I am living in the present not the past.

Until your beloved Amsoil 0W-20 beats Castrol Edge in the ASTM D-5293 test, which is not going to happen anytime soon, then I am saying NO THANKS to Amsoil 0W-20 and your annoying sales tactics.
quote:
Originally posted by Big Bear:
quote:
which Cold Cranking numbers are you talking about? Pennzoil 0w20 CCS Viscosity, cP (°C ) ASTM D-5293 5,600 (-35),AMSOIL 0w20 is only 4069. Pennzoil 0w20 is much thicker. No thanks.


Amsoil 0W-20 4069 @ -35

Castrol Edge 0W-20 3860 @ -35

Tim, I do not want to hear nor do I care about Castrol's Warranty or Amsoil's Warranty, nor do I care about Amsoil's 38 year history, I am living in the present not the past.

Until your beloved Amsoil 0W-20 beats Castrol Edge in the ASTM D-5293 test, which is not going to happen anytime soon, then I am saying NO THANKS to Amsoil 0W-20 and your annoying sales tactics.


http://www.amsoil.com/storefront/asm.aspx


Why is castrol better.....'overall',than Amsoil.



Also,3800+- vs 4000+- at -35.......Meaningless...both will flow very good at that temp I would think
quote:
Originally posted by Big Bear:
quote:
which Cold Cranking numbers are you talking about? Pennzoil 0w20 CCS Viscosity, cP (°C ) ASTM D-5293 5,600 (-35),AMSOIL 0w20 is only 4069. Pennzoil 0w20 is much thicker. No thanks.


Amsoil 0W-20 4069 @ -35

Castrol Edge 0W-20 3860 @ -35

Tim, I do not want to hear nor do I care about Castrol's Warranty or Amsoil's Warranty, nor do I care about Amsoil's 38 year history, I am living in the present not the past.

Until your beloved Amsoil 0W-20 beats Castrol Edge in the ASTM D-5293 test, which is not going to happen anytime soon, then I am saying NO THANKS to Amsoil 0W-20 and your annoying sales tactics.
And I'm saying NO THANKS to BP CASTROL for the largest environmental disaster in the United States. You really want to support a company like BP CASTROL with that environmental and safety record? I thought you were an American....
quote:
Originally posted by Big Bear:
quote:
Why is castrol better.....'overall',than Amsoil.


Captain Kirk, it has a better 40 Degree Celcius and 100 degree Celcius Number, I just want a thin oil for the WINTERTIME, and I just feel that Castrol Edge 0W-20 will serve my engine better than Amsoil 0W-20
I just feel that AMSOIL will serve our country better than BP/Castrol who can now claim the worst environmental disaster in the history of our country, plus killed dozens of Americans. I can't believe any American would want to support such a company...
I am glad that somebody finally noticed and admitted that the AMSOIL trademark slogan is just that and nothing more no proof of anything, but continuation of the deceptive practices that AMSOIL has always used, going back to the myth of military service by it's founder - who was nothing more than a mechanic on base in Alaska.

As for volume and trade information if you buy ExxonMobil stock you get annual report - you can find their data there.

If you are member of the Lubricant Industry you get trade publications with all the data, and unlike some of you I do have a respect for Copyright, and since those publications are not FREE or available on Web to unregistered users, likewise I will not "steal" and reprint their data.

But I will give you the link to ordering their guide

http://www.lngpublishing.com/BaseStockGuide/index.cfm

Hint: No company can "sell" more product (like Mobil 1 with PAO) than is their production capacity, unless of course what they sell is NOT what they claim it to be - i.e. really dilluted with other stuf. Only 5 companies in the world produce and sell commercially PAO. It has NEVER been priced by the Gallon, the price was and always is quoted in pounds (or in Europe in Kg).
Last edited by mirokefurt
quote:
Originally posted by Miro Kefurt:
I am glad that somebody finally noticed and admitted that the AMSOIL trademark slogan is just that and nothing more no proof of anything, but continuation of the deceptive practices that AMSOIL has always used, going back to the myth of military service by it's founder - who was nothing more than a mechanic on base in Alaska.
Nobody has admitted that. Certainly not AMSOIL, nor the United States Patent and Trademark Office. Nor disputed by any oil company, government agency, or consumer agency. If you feel that strongly, take it up with the US government. But since they already investigated the claims thoroughly, I don't think you will have any luck.

quote:
Originally posted by Miro Kefurt:As for volume and trade information if you buy ExxonMobil stock you get annual report - you can find theri data there.
. Please post. I already posted Exxon data that conflicts with what you said.

quote:
Originally posted by Miro Kefurt:If you are member of the Lubricant Industry you get trade publications with all the data, and unlike some of you I do have a respect for Copyright, and since tose publications are not FREE or available on Web to unregistered users, likewise I will not "steal" and reprint their data.
The information I published was FREE on the internet. Please provide specific report names, page numbers and proof of Copyright. You already gave some data, with no proof of anything. Go to any retail store, dealership, oil change place and you will find they sell much more than the 2% synthetic oil that you claim.
quote:
Tim Vipond


Please just stick with:

Natural Organic soil supplements for your yard and garden

At least there you can grow two crops next to each other in the same garden and have "proof" that it really works in just one growing season.

Yet I have not seen a single AMSOIL dealer do that YET, why not ???

Hey just ask Al to send me a certified copy of his discharge papers, that is all the proof I need.

Till then I will go by what I already know and have known for years...

Short of that I just want to understand how someone not in the service for admitedly years was in that same time promoted from "pilot" to "squadron commander".

All you have to do is check the "history" AMSOIL published 26 years and 32 years ago - even those claims DO not match, but then COLONEL DRAKE was no COLONEL either, may by that is why this was "perpetrated".

Pouring ETO-85 into just another bottle (from the metal can it used to come in) is not exactly formulating the first Synthetic Motor Oil, especially since the can lid has "NOT FOR USE AS MOTOR LUBRICANT" on it from OEM.

But hey if you have worn out old PINTO, not much more damage can happen by using it especially in Alaska.
quote:
Originally posted by Tim Vipond:
The information I published was FREE on the internet.


LOL

Ah so now any FREE Information on Internet becomes the new gospel.

"Well the Plaedians have just Landed using the LUXOR beam as a target destination, so I have to go, as I am a member of the extraterrestial welcoming commitee that really has only one objective to sperad unlimited gambling into the unknown universe!"

Must be true I found it on the Internet toooooo..........
quote:
Originally posted by Tim Vipond:
quote:
Originally posted by Big Bear:
quote:
which Cold Cranking numbers are you talking about? Pennzoil 0w20 CCS Viscosity, cP (°C ) ASTM D-5293 5,600 (-35),AMSOIL 0w20 is only 4069. Pennzoil 0w20 is much thicker. No thanks.


Amsoil 0W-20 4069 @ -35

Castrol Edge 0W-20 3860 @ -35

Tim, I do not want to hear nor do I care about Castrol's Warranty or Amsoil's Warranty, nor do I care about Amsoil's 38 year history, I am living in the present not the past.

Until your beloved Amsoil 0W-20 beats Castrol Edge in the ASTM D-5293 test, which is not going to happen anytime soon, then I am saying NO THANKS to Amsoil 0W-20 and your annoying sales tactics.
And I'm saying NO THANKS to BP CASTROL for the largest environmental disaster in the United States. You really want to support a company like BP CASTROL with that environmental and safety record? I thought you were an American....


And just what does that have to do with oil quality?
quote:
Originally posted by Tim Vipond:
quote:
Originally posted by Big Bear:
quote:
Why is castrol better.....'overall',than Amsoil.


Captain Kirk, it has a better 40 Degree Celcius and 100 degree Celcius Number, I just want a thin oil for the WINTERTIME, and I just feel that Castrol Edge 0W-20 will serve my engine better than Amsoil 0W-20
I just feel that AMSOIL will serve our country better than BP/Castrol who can now claim the worst environmental disaster in the history of our country, plus killed dozens of Americans. I can't believe any American would want to support such a company...


Is this what it has come to? Hysterics?
quote:
Originally posted by Big Bear:Amsoil Motor Oil is just too THICK, especially for the NORTHERN folks during the wintertime.

No it isn't. Look at the Pour Point and Cold Cranking numbers. None better. Pick the 0w-XX and all will be well. AMSOIL is VERY popular in cold climates.

Tim, lets look at some numbers of Redline 0W-20 versus Amsoil 0W-20

Pour Point for Amsoil 0W-20 is -65 Degrees Fahrenheit or -54 Degrees Celcius

Pour Point for Redline 0W-20 is -76 Degrees Fahrenheit or -60 Degrees Celcius

Lets look at some 40 Degree Celcius Numbers which is about 100 degrees Fahrenheit

Amsoil 0W-20 has a 40 Degree Celcius Number of 49.1

Redline 0W-20 has a 40 Degree Celcius Number of 43

What are these numbers telling me, since most of the wear in an engine is during the 1st 20 minutes of driving or maybe until the car is fully warmed up, since Redline 0W-20 has a lower Pour Point it will flow faster on startup, and during the warm up cycle since it has a lower 40 Degree Celcius Number it will flow faster and lubricate the parts in my engine quicker than Amsoil 0W-20

Tim, the Wear Statement I made, came from Gary Allan who is an Amsoil Salesman like yourself.

I almost forgot to mention the HTHS Number, that's High Temperature High Shear.

Amsoil 0W-20 has a HTHS Number of 2.8

Redline 0W-20 has a HTHS Number of 2.7
quote:
Originally posted by Trajan:
quote:
Originally posted by Tim Vipond:
quote:
Originally posted by Big Bear:
quote:
Why is castrol better.....'overall',than Amsoil.


Captain Kirk, it has a better 40 Degree Celcius and 100 degree Celcius Number, I just want a thin oil for the WINTERTIME, and I just feel that Castrol Edge 0W-20 will serve my engine better than Amsoil 0W-20
I just feel that AMSOIL will serve our country better than BP/Castrol who can now claim the worst environmental disaster in the history of our country, plus killed dozens of Americans. I can't believe any American would want to support such a company...


Is this what it has come to? Hysterics?


It seems so. Not to get into a pissing contest, the event in the Gulf is a tragic disaster. IIRC Exxon did a number in Alaska, with a drunken Super Tanker Captain in charge. I bet Amsoil does lots of business with XOM, so lets not throw stones in glass houses.

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