2 Cycle Oil as 4 Cycle Engine Fuel Additive

And you forget Tim.
I have no dog in the hunt. I am not advocating putting anything in your fuel. You are. I am not. And you look sorta silly summarily dismissing 500K folks (last post count on the subject using Web Trends tools) post on the subject. Because they have not paid SWRI or somebody to verify their personal observations.
I see we are all up early and I have to go feed the cattle. But it is fun anyway and I humbly drop out of this as I have been a mod on a major forum and I realize we have digressed here. I apologize to the moderators here and will drop the subject as it obviously is not answering the OP's original subject matter.

quote:

Originally posted by Sarge:
Is this just an Amsoil marketing site?

I sure hope not, maybe he has a deal with the mods, if so their house their rules. If not I wish they'd muzzle him so we could stay on topic!

I'm interested in your MMO feedback and results from the guys you have testing it. My family used it for decades with great results in both oil and gas. So did my buddy in NY. But they aren't scientists so Tim would rule them out, LOL.

Maybe you can post a link to this on the LS1 site if it is allowed and let them see what the Amsoil rep thinks of their findings.

AD

So you still haven't answered the very basic question why the 2 cycle oil companies aren't recommending this. Not to mention the gasoline and automotive companies. What do they know that you don't? Billions of dollars on research and testing? Still waiting....

Sarge did the research, the results posted on the LS1 forum speak volumes. Why not join the LS1 forum and ask? Lots of people there can give you answers, and you can explain to each and everyone of them why you feel they are wrong. Go for it! Oh wait they already have an Amsoil rep with some class, they'd probably run you off, nothing to gain there, sorry!

AD

What makes you think I feel they are wrong? They can do whatever they please. I'd just like to see scientific proof that it works and won't damage anything or decrease performance long term. Again, why don't the 2 cycle oil, gasoline and vehicle companies back this idea? Why doesn't the EPA back this idea? What do they know that you don't? Still waiting...again....

Ask them Tim. I know plenty of people doing it with either MMO or TCW3 for decades, and it works. You don't believe me, so go to the LS1 board and ask for yourself, mention the EPA while you're at it. Just because the EPA doesn't back it means nothing to me, and many others.

There are things the FDA approves and later it is found certain products they approved have killed people. Just look at the negative side effects many approved meds have..........Many smart people think out of the box Tim, and experiment with some pretty impressive results. Sarge proved it, you just can't accept it, go on LS1 and tell'em all they're wrong, or they don't have the EPA blessings.

AD

quote:

Originally posted by ADFD1:
Ask them Tim.

I have. Since Sarge is recommending a Shell product, I have contacted them by email for info.

quote:

Originally posted by ADFD1: I know plenty of people doing it with either MMO or TCW3 for decades, and it works.

Again you flip/flop. Earlier you said "I recently tried TC-W3 and for some reason like the MMO better in the gas. The engine seems to run well with either, but I have given up slight mpgs with the TC-W3. I also noticed that if you give too big a dose of TC-W3 the engine lacks some power, where as you would have to go hog wild with the MMO. Just my observations, YMMV."

Don't see them backing Amsoil use either. But I know of car makers who back Top Tier fuel. And one who backs Invigorate. And Techron.

Don't see the EPA telling anyone not to use TC-W3 in the fuel either.

Sarge hasn't posted on his LS1 2 cycle oil thread since Feb. People are asking him questions and he isn't responding. What's up with that?

Flip flop, you call that? Get real! Those are my observations. Further testing is needed for me with the TCW3. At least I have an open mind and I am willing to try and experiment, it is quite clear I am not here to sell as you are! My experiences are real, not made up in some lab to sell product.

In my case maybe less TCW3 is needed, maybe more, or maybe in my situation MMO is better. My NY buddy who I mention a lot noticed TCW3 reduced oil consumption, when added to the gas, something MMO didn't do for him, and he's been using MMO for close to 40 years I think.

Oh yea and Sarge mentioned 300 people testing MMO gas and oil IIRC. That caught me attention.

AD

quote:

Originally posted by Tim Vipond:
What makes you think I feel they are wrong? They can do whatever they please. I'd just like to see scientific proof that it works and won't damage anything or decrease performance long term. Again, why don't the 2 cycle oil, gasoline and vehicle companies back this idea? Why doesn't the EPA back this idea? What do they know that you don't? Still waiting...again....

Show me where the EPA back using Amsoil PI Tim.
Show you where it doesnt hurt anything long term? You gotta be absolutely high Tim. I think the TCW3 has been tested more miles by more people than any other product I ever heard of! And (God forbid) they actually are sharing their experiance all over the internet for the past 2-3 years!

quote:

Originally posted by Tim Vipond:
Sarge hasn't posted on his LS1 2 cycle oil thread since Feb. People are asking him questions and he isn't responding. What's up with that?

For the reading and comprehension impaired I say again. I retired from there Tim. I pretty much retired from the INTERNET for this very reason. Just so much BS and silliness it is just painful.

quote:

Originally posted by Sarge:

Show me where the EPA back using Amsoil PI Tim.

Some of you sure are fickle. First you don't want me to talk about AMSOIL, then that is all you want to talk about and ask me questions.

From http://www.amsoil.com/lit/g2543.pdf

"The fleet of test vehicles was put on a rolling chassis
dynamometer before and after P.i. treatment, measuring
each vehicle’s fuel economy numbers according to the
same method mandated by the federal government
and used by auto manufacturers to determine vehicle
fuel economy ratings. The blue bars on Graph E
indicate pre-treatment fuel economy numbers. The
red bars indicate fuel economy following one tank of
operation on P.i., showing an average fuel economy
improvement of more than 2 percent."

Don't you think the Federal Government or FTC or anyone would cry foul if this data was incorrect? They haven't.

Or their environmental claims of reducing vehicle emissions?

Another Ad! OUCH! Did I miss the EPA endorsements?

AD

quote:

Originally posted by Tim Vipond:

quote:

Originally posted by Sarge:

Show me where the EPA back using Amsoil PI Tim.

Some of you sure are fickle. First you don't want me to talk about AMSOIL, then that is all you want to talk about and ask me questions.

From http://www.amsoil.com/lit/g2543.pdf

"The fleet of test vehicles was put on a rolling chassis
dynamometer before and after P.i. treatment, measuring
each vehicle’s fuel economy numbers according to the
same method mandated by the federal government
and used by auto manufacturers to determine vehicle
fuel economy ratings. The blue bars on Graph E
indicate pre-treatment fuel economy numbers. The
red bars indicate fuel economy following one tank of
operation on P.i., showing an average fuel economy
improvement of more than 2 percent."

Don't you think the Federal Government or FTC or anyone would cry foul if this data was incorrect? They haven't.

Or their environmental claims of reducing vehicle emissions?

That's it? We haven't been sued so it must be true? My God...you are insane.
You know Tim....I have known guys like you in life. Everybody knows them as a fool. However in their mind they are brilliant. Your constant babble about Amsoil's silly ass marketing all over the INTERNET on every car forum....pimping yourself shamelessly....well I guess it is funny as hell you think you have any type of credibility anywhere with anybody.
You think of yourself as quite sly by asking for ridiculous "certified testing" over a simple fuel add that has been around for 50+years. Guys have been using 2stroke oil in their fuel long before I showed up.I am selling nothing. Your agenda is clear (your profit) and why this forum puts up with your silly painful post is beyond me.... but it isn't my forum.
I'll say again.....I document folks experience as they share it with me. Period. That is the end of it. Take with it what you wish. I could care less.I have no agenda and have nothing to prove to some silly Amsoil "Jobber" from Houston for sure.
Maybe Pablo or CompSyn can share with you how much damage you Amsoil dealers do to Amsoil Corp. on these forums with your silly Amsoil sponsored 4ball test et al.
So the kabillion post in numerous forums reflecting personal non -paid testimony must be true because the Feds havent sued anybody for saying TCW3 in their fuel had benefits. Using your own rational Tim.

Now shotgun, I shot a lot of that too, mostly trap on Eastern Long Island. I never reloaded them though.

AD

PS MMO claims on the label says: Improves Fuel Economy". They have been in business close to 85 years give or take. No problems I'm aware of making that claim, "Cleans Engines From The Inside Out", i think that's on the label too. No problems with that claim either. The nice thing about TCW3 and MMO is there are no company shills pushing it on these boards. Just honest testimony, and a lot of it too!

AD

quote:

Originally posted by Sarge:
I pretty much retired from the INTERNET for this very reason. Just so much BS and silliness it is just painful.

So why are you here again? Oh yeah, to provide us the useful data you've collected from anonymous posters with anecdotes which some say two stroke oil is good for 4 stroke engines and others say they saw no difference, and others like AD say they lost mpg and performance, and others worried about long term damage. Two stroke oil companies aren't supporting any of your statements. They'd be run out of town if they followed your example.

quote:

Originally posted by Sarge:

quote:

Originally posted by Tim Vipond:

quote:

Originally posted by Sarge:

Show me where the EPA back using Amsoil PI Tim.

Some of you sure are fickle. First you don't want me to talk about AMSOIL, then that is all you want to talk about and ask me questions.

From http://www.amsoil.com/lit/g2543.pdf

"The fleet of test vehicles was put on a rolling chassis
dynamometer before and after P.i. treatment, measuring
each vehicle’s fuel economy numbers according to the
same method mandated by the federal government
and used by auto manufacturers to determine vehicle
fuel economy ratings. The blue bars on Graph E
indicate pre-treatment fuel economy numbers. The
red bars indicate fuel economy following one tank of
operation on P.i., showing an average fuel economy
improvement of more than 2 percent."

Don't you think the Federal Government or FTC or anyone would cry foul if this data was incorrect? They haven't.

Or their environmental claims of reducing vehicle emissions?

That's it? We haven't been sued so it must be true? .

The oil industry and government does a pretty good job keeping oil company claims in check.
Exxon took Castrol to task over their definition of synthetic oil.
Castrol took Royal Purple to task over their testimonials they tried to pass on as fact. They forced Royal Purple to correct their "information" on their website.
Castrol and Valvoline took Exxon to task over Mobil 1 failure to pass wear tests that Exxon claimed they met.
FTC took many of those gasoline saving devices to task and took them off the market.
FTC took ZMAX to task and had them change some of their claims and set up a consumer refund account.
No two stroke oil manufacture has made the claims you make as they know they couldn't prove them.

If you are so certain that 2 stroke oil works marvels and miracles in 4 stroke engines, why don't you market it? Maybe because you know deep down you wouldn't be able to prove it?

quote:

Originally posted by ADFD1:

PS MMO claims on the label says: Improves Fuel Economy". They have been in business close to 85 years give or take. No problems I'm aware of making that claim, "Cleans Engines From The Inside Out", i think that's on the label too. No problems with that claim either.

AD

Didn't Marvel go out of business about 10 years ago? Hmmm....

Are you a company shill for MMO? Doesn't your anonymous dad and uncle push it and sell it at their anonymous auto shop? Seems like you bring it up repeatedly in every thread. Any test data you would like to share? Or is it just anonymous anecdotes...

Tim,
Allow me to approach this form a different angle.
Amsoil has been in business since what? 1959 or something. In this 50 years they have captured less than 1% of the global sales of the engine oil market. If it was so good why such a small market share? If it was so good why wouldn't the automotive manufacturers all use it? Amsoil has spent significant resources polishing the pig with all kinds of 4ball wear test and paid "test" showing they are the best of the best. Mobil1 has 60%+ of the market. They just laugh at Amsoil and make no attempt to even acknowledge Amsoil exist. Same with SOPUS.

In the fast lube market here in the US. Amsoil has a 4% share and Mobil1 has their 60% again.
But lets look at the top seller in these fast oil change joints. It is additives Tim. This is why I even took on the effort to have this "additive" discussed among those who are making buying decisions. If I can get the same results (real or imagined) with something that cost pennies per application versus an application that cost $20 bucks....then it is worth discussing. So I did. I also have discussed on the WWW nitrogen in your tires, high flow air filters, magic spark plugs on and on and all kinds of oil discussions and marketing hype versus real world results. Royal Purple took a beating in these marketing versus real world results discussions. Amsoil did very well. I have led return on investment discussions as ROI pertains to various oil products and additives.

The TCW3 discussion is no different Tim. Nobody selling anything. Just discussion. Nobody gives a rats butt about any marketing test. We are discussing the usage and individual observations of the usage of TCW3 in their fuel.

Hopefully you can see how far off the mark you are by your position here. We are not selling anything (unlike you)...so we have no desire nor requirement to test anything nor provide data to any knucklehead. We are discussing individual observations. Good or bad. We discuss it. Many have posted compression test....some share before and after state exhaust test data when they got their car inspected....stuff like that....and it is all out there on the WWW.
Get it Tim?
http://www.amsoil.com/news/200..._fastlube_market.pdf

Christ, Tim sounds more and more like a synlube pusher.......

I can see why Sarge all but completely retired from the internet. All this crap over a product he doesn't sell.

And I'm really tired of hearing how their sales are at record levels, or how they're #1, etc.

Let's see the proof.

quote:

Originally posted by Trajan:
Christ, Tim sounds more and more like a synlube pusher.......

I can see why Sarge all but completely retired from the internet. All this crap over a product he doesn't sell.

And I'm really tired of hearing how their sales are at record levels, or how they're #1, etc.

Let's see the proof.

Sickening isn't it Trajan? I wish they'd muzzle him so we could stay on topic, and not have to deal with his constant rebuttals and Amsoil pushing. I could see why Sarge would want to retire from the Internet, its this Kind of grind that can get old real fast. Hang in there Sarge, Tim is losing in the popularity poles.

Tim- FYI Turtle Wax bought the MMO company, the product is alive and well, No problems with the FTC or the EPA either. No payouts for blown engines either.

AD

PS Marvel Mystery Oil Company was formed in 1923. Initially based in Chicago, the company moved to New York City and then in 1941 moved to its long-time home in Port Chester, New York. In 1999, the Marvel Oil Company was acquired by Turtle Wax, Inc. and is now headquartered back in its hometown in the Chicago area.

quote:

Originally posted by Sarge:
Tim,
Allow me to approach this form a different angle.
Amsoil has been in business since what? 1959 or something.

Since you insist again on going off topic to talk about AMSOIL, it look's like you need a lesson in AMSOIL history: "Amatuzio began conducting serious research in 1963. By 1966 he had formulated a synthetic motor oil and put it to use in vehicles in northern Minnesota. Throughout the late ’60s Amatuzio continued his research and development and sold commercially available synthetic oils under a variety of names. In 1970 he incorporated his own name into a commercially sold product called AMMOIL. In 1971 this product name was changed to AMZOIL and it continued to be sold commercially. The true milestone came in 1972 when AMZOIL became the first synthetic motor oil in the world to meet American Petroleum Institute criteria. The new lubricant performed like no other before it. When the first can appeared on the market in 1972, it signaled the birth of an entire industry. AMSOIL synthetic lubricants have expanded the boundaries of lubrication science and redefined the performance possibilities of modern machinery and engines."

quote:

Originally posted by Sarge: In this 50 years they have captured less than 1% of the global sales of the engine oil market. If it was so good why such a small market share?

AMSOIL doesn't compete globally. Just US and Canada with a few outlets worldwide. And only in the synthetic oil market which is about 10% of all oil sales in the US. And in the extended oil change market, which is about 10% of that, AMSOIL has far more of that share, about 80%, than Mobil 1 EP and Castrol Edge. AMSOIL refuses to sell to WalMart and the other huge retailers to support their AMSOIL dealers.

quote:

Originally posted by Sarge: They If it was so good why wouldn't the automotive manufacturers all use it?

AMSOIL is a US company and made here. Most automotive manufacturers have world wide manufacturing and distribution. Why would they want to use it if it is not available to them and their worldwide customers? Auto manufactures tend to use the lowest cost oil that meets their specs that gets them past the warranty period. And many have their own oil brands they push. Why pay more dollars for the best oil, when a midlevel oil accomplishes all of this for them? And NONE of them say you can't upgrade to AMSOIL or that it will void factory warranty, even with extended oil change intervals.

quote:

Originally posted by Sarge: Amsoil has spent significant resources polishing the pig with all kinds of 4ball wear test and paid "test" showing they are the best of the best.

Yep. And undisputed by the industry. The 4 ball test is a widely accepted ASTM test. All oil manufacturers use it. Only AMSOIL publishes the test results. None of the competition disputes AMSOIL's test data.

quote:

Originally posted by Sarge: yet only have a fraction Mobil1 has 60%+ of the market.

Mobil 1 only has 10% of the extended oil change interval market. AMSOIL has 80%.

quote:

Originally posted by Sarge: They just laugh at Amsoil and make no attempt to even acknowledge Amsoil exist. Same with SOPUS.

Where have they laughed? I found 8 results on AMSOIL on the Mobil1 website. Seems like a lot of acknowledgment. Why do they copy AMSOIL in these firsts? Seems Exxon must admire AMSOIL's accomplishments a lot to try to copy them (sincerest form of flattery). In fact Mobil told Amatuzio he should feel honored that they copied him when Mobil came out with Mobil 1 25,000 mile oil a few years after AMSOIL :

The Company of Firsts
AMSOIL has a documented history of innovation and leadership.

First to develop an API-rated 100 percent synthetic motor oil.
First to introduce the concept of "extended drain intervals" with a recommended 25,000-mile/1-year drain interval.
First U.S. company to utilize the NOACK volatility test as a standard of performance excellence.
First to produce synthetic motor oils for diesel engines, racing engines, turbo and marine engines.
First to introduce synthetic oils that legitimately contribute to improving fuel efficiency.
First to manufacture synthetic gear lube for automotive use.
First to manufacture a 100:1 pre-mix synthetic 2-cycle oil.
First to manufacture a synthetic automatic transmission fluid for automotive use.

I defer to the forum here. I tried to keep the subject matter to TallPauls original subject matter....but no...we all have to be trolled by Tim The Amsoil Nazi. "Where is the data on TCW3" "Here is the history of Amsoil" "Here is all the polished pig Amsoil marketing links"
Just unreal. Tim it does not work man.
I am heading to my place in Grand Cayman Tim. I'll check back with you from there. My ranch is just outside of Boerne. Your close. You should really stop by and see our operation here. I have one of the top Amsoil "Jobbers" here who is a good friend and very succesful engine builder. I also have a good friend who is a Shaefeers distributor. We all get along just fine and have some very good discussions on oil and such. You should join one of our "feed store and coffee" discussions. I am truly amazed at your post and must met you to see for myself.

quote:

Originally posted by Sarge:
I got tired of talking with you Tim so I went and had an intelligent discussion with one of my steers.
Unbelievable from a grown man. Just unreal.
I defer to the forum here. I tried to keep the subject matter to TallPauls original subject matter....but no...we all have to be trolled by Tim The Amsoil Nazi. "Where is the data on TCW3" "Here is the history of Amsoil" "Here is all the polished pig Amsoil marketing links"
Just unreal.

I just wanted to discuss TCW3. It was you and others who kept bringing up and asking about AMSOIL. I was just answering your questions. You don't seem very interested in discussing TCW3. Why is that?

You said "All I can say is we have documented well over 6 million miles in our volunteers automobiles since I began this experiment.
To date not one negative. So many postives from quiter fuel pumps to MPG increases to quieter valve assembly.
I do not defend nor sale anything. I just set it up and documented all of it."

So let's see your documentation...

quote:

Originally posted by Tim Vipond:

quote:

Originally posted by Sarge:
I got tired of talking with you Tim so I went and had an intelligent discussion with one of my steers.
Unbelievable from a grown man. Just unreal.
I defer to the forum here. I tried to keep the subject matter to TallPauls original subject matter....but no...we all have to be trolled by Tim The Amsoil Nazi. "Where is the data on TCW3" "Here is the history of Amsoil" "Here is all the polished pig Amsoil marketing links"
Just unreal.

I just wanted to discuss TCW3. It was you and others who kept bringing up and asking about AMSOIL. I was just answering your questions. You don't seem very interested in discussing TCW3. Why is that?

You said "All I can say is we have documented well over 6 million miles in our volunteers automobiles since I began this experiment.
To date not one negative. So many postives from quiter fuel pumps to MPG increases to quieter valve assembly.
I do not defend nor sale anything. I just set it up and documented all of it."

So let's see your documentation...

It is all posted on the WWW. Have fun!

And by the way...I edited my post there on you Tim...I felt it was too harsh so I changed it while you were responding there.

Tim it was your shameless self serving Amsoil plug, just like 95% of your posts here plugging Amsoil that tossed this topic into the crapper. We were trying to discuss TCW3 and UCL in general, can we do that in peace without Amsoil plugs, ads, statistics, and history? You are turning people off to Amsoil big time!

AD

quote:

Originally posted by Sarge:

quote:

Originally posted by Tim Vipond:

quote:

Originally posted by Sarge:
I got tired of talking with you Tim so I went and had an intelligent discussion with one of my steers.
Unbelievable from a grown man. Just unreal.
I defer to the forum here. I tried to keep the subject matter to TallPauls original subject matter....but no...we all have to be trolled by Tim The Amsoil Nazi. "Where is the data on TCW3" "Here is the history of Amsoil" "Here is all the polished pig Amsoil marketing links"
Just unreal.

I just wanted to discuss TCW3. It was you and others who kept bringing up and asking about AMSOIL. I was just answering your questions. You don't seem very interested in discussing TCW3. Why is that?

You said "All I can say is we have documented well over 6 million miles in our volunteers automobiles since I began this experiment.
To date not one negative. So many postives from quiter fuel pumps to MPG increases to quieter valve assembly.
I do not defend nor sale anything. I just set it up and documented all of it."

So let's see your documentation...

It is all posted on the WWW. Have fun!

Where is YOUR documentation? Please provide.

quote:

Originally posted by Tim Vipond:

quote:

Originally posted by Sarge:

quote:

Originally posted by Tim Vipond:

quote:

Originally posted by Sarge:
I got tired of talking with you Tim so I went and had an intelligent discussion with one of my steers.
Unbelievable from a grown man. Just unreal.
I defer to the forum here. I tried to keep the subject matter to TallPauls original subject matter....but no...we all have to be trolled by Tim The Amsoil Nazi. "Where is the data on TCW3" "Here is the history of Amsoil" "Here is all the polished pig Amsoil marketing links"
Just unreal.

I just wanted to discuss TCW3. It was you and others who kept bringing up and asking about AMSOIL. I was just answering your questions. You don't seem very interested in discussing TCW3. Why is that?

You said "All I can say is we have documented well over 6 million miles in our volunteers automobiles since I began this experiment.
To date not one negative. So many postives from quiter fuel pumps to MPG increases to quieter valve assembly.
I do not defend nor sale anything. I just set it up and documented all of it."

So let's see your documentation...

It is all posted on the WWW. Have fun!

Where is YOUR documentation? Please provide.

I have heard Silvan Learning Center has opening in their reading and comprehension class Tim. You can contact them at your convenience.
Documentation of thousands of people discussing putting TCW3 in their fuel? You are high aren't you?

quote:

Originally posted by ADFD1:
Tim it was your shameless self serving Amsoil plug, just like 95% of your posts here plugging Amsoil that tossed this topic into the crapper. We were trying to discuss TCW3 and UCL in general, can we do that in peace without Amsoil plugs, ads, statistics, and history? You are turning people off to Amsoil big time!

AD

Amsoil is aware of Tim trust me. Gotta run...the car is here....off to Cayman....

So you have no document. Just internet "BS and silliness" as you put it... And lots of insults. Nice...

quote:

Originally posted by Tim Vipond:

quote:

Originally posted by Sarge:
I got tired of talking with you Tim so I went and had an intelligent discussion with one of my steers.
Unbelievable from a grown man. Just unreal.
I defer to the forum here. I tried to keep the subject matter to TallPauls original subject matter....but no...we all have to be trolled by Tim The Amsoil Nazi. "Where is the data on TCW3" "Here is the history of Amsoil" "Here is all the polished pig Amsoil marketing links"
Just unreal.

I just wanted to discuss TCW3. It was you and others who kept bringing up and asking about AMSOIL. I was just answering your questions. You don't seem very interested in discussing TCW3. Why is that?

You said "All I can say is we have documented well over 6 million miles in our volunteers automobiles since I began this experiment.
To date not one negative. So many postives from quiter fuel pumps to MPG increases to quieter valve assembly.
I do not defend nor sale anything. I just set it up and documented all of it."

So let's see your documentation...

If you just wanted to discuss TC-W3, explain this then:

Tim Vipond
Level 4 - 251 to 500 posts
Posted Oct 14, 3:54 PM Hide Post
Why not use a product formulated specifically for your purpose such as https://www.amsoil.com/storefront/api.aspx?zo=1181889 ?

Not only is that NOT TC-W3, it is also, despite your claim, the first mention of Amsoil in this thread.

No one was talking Amsoil till you stuck your oar in.

quote:

Originally posted by Trajan:

quote:

Originally posted by Tim Vipond:

quote:

Originally posted by Sarge:
I got tired of talking with you Tim so I went and had an intelligent discussion with one of my steers.
Unbelievable from a grown man. Just unreal.
I defer to the forum here. I tried to keep the subject matter to TallPauls original subject matter....but no...we all have to be trolled by Tim The Amsoil Nazi. "Where is the data on TCW3" "Here is the history of Amsoil" "Here is all the polished pig Amsoil marketing links"
Just unreal.

I just wanted to discuss TCW3. It was you and others who kept bringing up and asking about AMSOIL. I was just answering your questions. You don't seem very interested in discussing TCW3. Why is that?

You said "All I can say is we have documented well over 6 million miles in our volunteers automobiles since I began this experiment.
To date not one negative. So many postives from quiter fuel pumps to MPG increases to quieter valve assembly.
I do not defend nor sale anything. I just set it up and documented all of it."

So let's see your documentation...

If you just wanted to discuss TC-W3, explain this then:

Tim Vipond
Level 4 - 251 to 500 posts
Posted Oct 14, 3:54 PM Hide Post
Why not use a product formulated specifically for your purpose such as https://www.amsoil.com/storefront/api.aspx?zo=1181889 ?

Not only is that NOT TC-W3, it is also, despite your claim, the first mention of Amsoil in this thread.

No one was talking Amsoil till you stuck your oar in.

It was a legitimate question. Why use TCW3 when the TCW3 manufacturers don't recommend it. Why not use products that were formulated for, tested, and have already proven for that application? I was hoping for a good reason, but none was given. Still waiting...

Open your mind Tim think out of the box, try and learn. Join LS1 ask for a good reason why all those people are using TCW3, and with good results, then tell'em how you really feel! Plug Amsoil there, I'm sure they'd love to hear from ya!

AD

quote:

Originally posted by ADFD1:
Open your mind Tim think out of the box, try and learn. Join LS1 ask for a good reason why all those people are using TCW3, and with good results, then tell'em how you really feel! Plug Amsoil there, I'm sure they'd love to hear from ya!

AD

AMSOIL is already discussed there. I think there is an AMSOIL sponsor there. Very positive results. Good enough for me.

I got a response from the Pennzoil technical group:

From: pqsandcarcaretechnical-us@shell.com
Subject: Re: Pennzoil Synthetic Marine Full Synthetic 2 cycle oil in 4 cycle engines.
Date: December 13, 2010 8:34:45 AM CST
To: timvipond@comcast.net

Dear Consumer,

No matter what other people say. Do not use 2 cycle engine oil in a
4 cycle motor. You will cause major damage to your engine.

Regards,
Technical Service, sn
On Sun, 12 Dec 2010 14:58:10 -0600 you wrote:

Do you recommend the use of Pennzoil Marine Full Synthetic 2 cycle
oil in 4 cycle gasoline automotive engines?

Why or why not?

It is being recommended and tested here: http://www.ls1.com/forums/
showthread.php?t=91206 .

Any benefits? Any drawbacks? Have you done testing?



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The way I read that it can be taken as (used in the crankcase instead of engine oil), and yes that will wreck an engine. It should have been asked if it could be added to the gas as a UCL. The legal dept would probably so no anyway. So the question IMO was worded wrong.

When you think out of the box you're on your own. The response was typical a of an oil company's legal response. Maybe they should try and ask the question again. My .02$

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quote:

Originally posted by ADFD1:
The way I read that it can be taken as (used in the crankcase instead of engine oil), and yes that will wreck an engine. It should have been asked if it could be added to the gas as a UCL. The legal dept would probably so no anyway. So the question IMO was worded wrong.

When you think out of the box you're on your own. The response was typical a of an oil company's legal response. Maybe they should try and ask the question again. My .02$

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I provided them the link where the discussion takes place about their product and the application.

Feel free to contact them with your questions.

I'm sure Shell scientists, like all scientists, "think out of the box" all the time.

Doubt they'll even bother with the link, the question was worded wrong, or intentionally worded that way to get a calculated response. Reading that question that answer is almost word for word how I would have replied.

Their answer doesn't matter to me, I know it works, I know MMO works, doesn't matter what I'm told. The LS1 forum just proves my point even more. Children ask questions a certain way to get an answer they are looking for. LOL

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Nice try Tim I see it was you who asked the question...................LOL

Guys, here is the scoop, our Amsoil Salesman named Tim Vipond, has been BANNED from Bitog and just about every other automotive forum.

He will say ANYTHING to push Amsoil and line his pockets with your money, all of Amsoil's so called tests are BOGUS since the lab that does there tests are owned by Amsoil.

I do not need any tests on either 2-cycle oil or MMO in the fuel since I know that it works and does no harm.

Tim has been laughed at on so many other forums as just another pushy Amsoil salesman.

Do any of the so called automakers recommend using Amsoil, or do they say that it is there factory fill.

Remember guys, when you listen to Tim, you need to realize that he is not a car guy, but he is really an Amsoil Salesperson.

Tim, worked on the fuel side at Shell, that is where he gets his pension, he is just shilling Amsoil for some extra money. He has absolutely no knowledge about MOTOR OIL's or anything else.

I am willing to bet that he was just a PAPER PUSHER for Shell and his credentials are really worthless for any discussion that we are having here.

Tim has a habit of jumping into threads just to push his own agenda, he cares more about putting money in his own pocket as opposed to what is best for us car guys.

I know many Amsoil salesman who feel that Tim is doing a disservice for the Amsoil brand name, the problem is that since he is an INDEPENDENT AMSOIL SALESMAN he can say what he wants and the sad truth is that as long as Amsoil is selling product, they really do not care.

I long for the day when Amsoil is sold at Wal-Mart and they get rid of worthless sales people like Tim who will say anything to push the product, until that time comes, then I guess we will have to keep reading Tim's wacky posts that just provide us with confusion with the hopes that we will buy Amsoil products.

All he provides us is with confusion, scare tactics, personal attacks on other products with absolutely no proof that these other products are harmful to our engines.