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quote:
Originally posted by Trajan:
quote:
Originally posted by Tim Vipond:
quote:
Originally posted by Trajan:
And yet, not a single European auto maker, on a continent where extended OCI is the norm, uses amsoil as a factory fill.
AMSOIL is made and marketed in the USA. Why would a European auto maker that manufactures, distributes and services world wide use an oil that is mainly only available in the US and Canada?

And why do you continually go off topic?


1: Said Euro cars are also sold here. In large numbers too.
So you expect them to factory fill and test them in Europe with AMSOIL, when AMSOIL isn't available?

quote:
Originally posted by Trajan:2: Said Euro cars have long OCIs here too.
Yes, and they specify the product specifications which AMSOIL meets if AMSOIL recommends it.

quote:
Originally posted by Trajan:3: So again? Why isn't it FF for all the BMWs, Audis, Mercedes, RR, Bentleys, Ferarris, MINIs, ad infinitum, sold here?
So again. See my response to #1.

quote:
Originally posted by Trajan:4: You would do well to keep in mind that it was YOU who took a thread on 2 cycle oil as 4 cycle engine fuel additive and proceeded to push amsoil. Again.
Actually I asked why use a two stroke oil that is not recommended by 2 stroke oil and vehicle manufacturers when other products like AMSOIL are specifically made, tested and recommended for that purpose? You keep bringing AMSOIL back into it.

quote:
Originally posted by Trajan:5: Again, what TC-W3 oil are you using in your car/s?
I'm not using any TC-W3 oil in my car. The TC-W3 manufacturers warn against it (as Shell did) and I've never seen auto makers recommend it. It would void your warranty if it was found to be the cause of failure. And the 2 cycle manufacturer wouldn't either. You'd be on your own. Why take the chance?
Lets think about this:

Tim's remarks to Trajan:

1: Said Euro cars are also sold here. In large numbers too.
So you expect them to factory fill and test them in Europe with AMSOIL, when AMSOIL isn't available?


If the Euro car makers thought Amsoi was so great they'd buy and use it. Amsoil would be very happy to supply it too. They send it over by the boat load. Get real!
quote:
Originally posted by ADFD1:
Lets think about this:

Tim's remarks to Trajan:

1: Said Euro cars are also sold here. In large numbers too.
So you expect them to factory fill and test them in Europe with AMSOIL, when AMSOIL isn't available?


If the Euro car makers thought Amsoi was so great they'd buy and use it. Amsoil would be very happy to supply it too. They send it over by the boat load. Get real!
And how would they buy AMSOIL? WalMart tried, and AMSOIL refused. AMSOIL has said they are not going to pay auto companies for them to be put on their approved lists. If AMSOIL was used as a factory fill, the auto manufacturer would be sued by the other companies that paid to be on their lists.

Why don't you stay on topic and tell us more how 2 cycle oil decreased your MPG and performance?
There is a big list of BMW approved oils. Far more than BMWNA has listed.

There is a BMW assembly plant in Spartanburg, South Carolina. I think they assemble the X series now, as they moved Z4 production back to Germany.

Now they use Castrol as FF. Not the German Castrol 0w-30 either.

So, why is it that I can buy Made in Germany 0w-30 European Formula at my local Auto Zone, Advanced Auto, or Pep Boys.

Just how does it get here??????

The Castrol oil at the dealerships is rebadged TXT. And I think it's made in Europe. Never see it at either the three stores above or NAPA or National Auto.

So just how does it get here???????????
quote:
Originally posted by ADFD1:
Lets think about this:

Tim's remarks to Trajan:

1: Said Euro cars are also sold here. In large numbers too.
So you expect them to factory fill and test them in Europe with AMSOIL, when AMSOIL isn't available?


If the Euro car makers thought Amsoi was so great they'd buy and use it. Amsoil would be very happy to supply it too. They send it over by the boat load. Get real!


But first, it has to be tested. Which amsoil would have to pay for. Apparently they can't afford it.
quote:
Originally posted by Trajan:
There is a big list of BMW approved oils. Far more than BMWNA has listed.

There is a BMW assembly plant in Spartanburg, South Carolina. I think they assemble the X series now, as they moved Z4 production back to Germany.

Now they use Castrol as FF. Not the German Castrol 0w-30 either.

So, why is it that I can buy Made in Germany 0w-30 European Formula at my local Auto Zone, Advanced Auto, or Pep Boys.

Just how does it get here??????
The Castrol oil at the dealerships is rebadged TXT. And I think it's made in Europe. Never see it anywhere else.

So just how does it get here???????????
I imagine they ship it through the oiled and bloodied waters they produced last year.
Then there is no point in you being here, is there.

Oh, BTW:

Unlike four-cycle engines which have a closed crankcase, these lightweight engines use the crankcase as part of the induction tract, and therefore, oil must be mixed with petrol to be distributed throughout the engine for lubrication. The two-stroke oil is ultimately burned along with the fuel resulting in exhaust emissions with blue smoke and/or a distinctive odor.

The oil-base stock is either petroleum, vegetable, semi-synthetic or synthetic oil and is mixed with petrol/gasoline at a fuel-to-oil ratio ranging from 16:1 to as low as 100:1.

Can you point out in my owners manual where it says not to use TC-W3? Or where it says I should use PI?

Can you show a TSB from a auto maker that says I should use PI? I have one that says I can use Techron if I don't use Top Tier fuel.
quote:
Originally posted by Trajan:
Then there is no point in you being here, is there.


Bingo!

quote:
Originally posted by Tim Vipond:

Why don't you stay on topic and tell us more how 2 cycle oil decreased your MPG and performance?


Tim I'm very happy to report TCW3 is performing as Sarge has proven time and time again. MMO works very well too. You are totally clueless.

AD
quote:
Originally posted by Trajan:
Then there is no point in you being here, is there.

Oh, BTW:

Unlike four-cycle engines which have a closed crankcase, these lightweight engines use the crankcase as part of the induction tract, and therefore, oil must be mixed with petrol to be distributed throughout the engine for lubrication. The two-stroke oil is ultimately burned along with the fuel resulting in exhaust emissions with blue smoke and/or a distinctive odor.

The oil-base stock is either petroleum, vegetable, semi-synthetic or synthetic oil and is mixed with petrol/gasoline at a fuel-to-oil ratio ranging from 16:1 to as low as 100:1.
I think we all know that 2 cycle oil is used in 2 cycle engines. What I want to know is do 2 cycle oil companies and auto manufacturers recommend it as a 4 cycle engine fuel additive?
quote:
Originally posted by ADFD1:
quote:
Originally posted by Trajan:
Then there is no point in you being here, is there.


Bingo!

quote:
Originally posted by Tim Vipond:

Why don't you stay on topic and tell us more how 2 cycle oil decreased your MPG and performance?


Tim I'm very happy to report TCW3 is performing as Sarge has proven time and time again. MMO works very well too. You are totally clueless.

AD
Where has he proven it? And if so, why don't the 2 cycle and auto manufacturers recommend it? He says he has a report, but has yet to produce it. You said it decreased your mpg and performance. Which anonymous anecdote should we believe? Why do gasoline companies go to great pains to remove oil from gasoline if it works so well?
quote:
Originally posted by Tim Vipond:
quote:
Originally posted by ADFD1:
quote:
Originally posted by Trajan:
Then there is no point in you being here, is there.


Bingo!

quote:
Originally posted by Tim Vipond:

Why don't you stay on topic and tell us more how 2 cycle oil decreased your MPG and performance?


Tim I'm very happy to report TCW3 is performing as Sarge has proven time and time again. MMO works very well too. You are totally clueless.

AD
Where has he proven it? And if so, why don't the 2 cycle and auto manufacturers recommend it? He says he has a report, but has yet to produce it. You said it decreased your mpg and performance. Which anonymous anecdote should we believe? Why do gasoline companies go to great pains to remove oil from gasoline if it works so well?


Read Tim: "Tim I'm very happy to report TCW3 is performing as Sarge has proven time and time again". Let me try English. "I am happy to report"......... I = me Tim............

Like to play with words like you did with your email to Shell? The email could easily have been understood to mean adding TCW3 to the crankcase. But you hand picked the wording, very calculated to generate the answer you wanted. I already mentioned that though. Oil companies also have to worry about the legal side of their businesses, so they won't suggest TCW3 being added to gas. Think out of the box Tim, it might help you shill more Amsoil. Then go to the LS1 board and let the guys know how you feel about the TCW3 being added to gas, how it reduces mpg, ruins, cats, and anything else you can muster.

Time to go, enjoy the evening guys!

AD

Last thought.

Tim you said this: Where has he proven it? And if so, why don't the 2 cycle and auto manufacturers recommend it?

If everyone listened to the auto manufactures they'd use API certified oil. That would hurt sales of SSO and ASM since Amsoil won't pay for the certs. They just claim it exceeds it.
quote:
Originally posted by ADFD1:
quote:
Originally posted by Tim Vipond:
quote:
Originally posted by ADFD1:
quote:
Originally posted by Trajan:
Then there is no point in you being here, is there.


Bingo!

quote:
Originally posted by Tim Vipond:

Why don't you stay on topic and tell us more how 2 cycle oil decreased your MPG and performance?


Tim I'm very happy to report TCW3 is performing as Sarge has proven time and time again. MMO works very well too. You are totally clueless.

AD
Where has he proven it? And if so, why don't the 2 cycle and auto manufacturers recommend it? He says he has a report, but has yet to produce it. You said it decreased your mpg and performance. Which anonymous anecdote should we believe? Why do gasoline companies go to great pains to remove oil from gasoline if it works so well?


Read Tim: "Tim I'm very happy to report TCW3 is performing as Sarge has proven time and time again". Let me try English. "I am happy to report"......... I = me Tim............

Like to play with words like you did with your email to Shell? The email could easily have been understood to mean adding TCW3 to the crankcase. But you hand picked the wording, very calculated to generate the answer you wanted. I already mentioned that though. Oil companies also have to worry about the legal side of their businesses, so they won't suggest TCW3 being added to gas. Think out of the box Tim, it might help you shill more Amsoil. Then go to the LS1 board and let the guys know how you feel about the TCW3 being added to gas, how it reduces mpg, ruins, cats, and anything else you can muster.

Time to go, enjoy the evening guys!

AD
I didn't say it reduced mpg or performance, you did. Page 1 of this thread.

In my email to Shell, I posted the thread where it was discussed using Shell's TC-W3. They had all the info. They made the call. Against their own 2 cycle oil. Let's see...what were their exact words again?
"From: pqsandcarcaretechnical-us@shell.com
Subject: Re: Pennzoil Synthetic Marine Full Synthetic 2 cycle oil in 4 cycle engines.
Date: December 13, 2010 8:34:45 AM CST
To: timvipond@comcast.net

Dear Consumer,

No matter what other people say. Do not use 2 cycle engine oil in a
4 cycle motor. You will cause major damage to your engine.

Regards,
Technical Service, sn"
quote:
Originally posted by ADFD1:

Last thought.

Tim you said this: Where has he proven it? And if so, why don't the 2 cycle and auto manufacturers recommend it?

If everyone listened to the auto manufactures they'd use API certified oil. That would hurt sales of SSO and ASM since Amsoil won't pay for the certs. They just claim it exceeds it.



None of the auto manufacturers state that it is required to use API certified oil for vehicles in the US. AMSOIL has 8 API certified oils for those who feel that is important. Several API certified oils failed API certification tests when pulled from the shelf. None have ever been AMSOIL. Plus AMSOIL warranties their oil for all lubricated parts and labor should their oil ever fail (it never has). Nor has it ever voided a factory warranty, even with extended oil change intervals.
September Tim, my dosing was off, remember I was using MMO in the gas and made the change. The TCW3 dose I was using was a little to much. Sorry I didn't update you. All is well now. Just for the record Tim I do switch to MMO from time to time too. Make a note of that.

A buddy of mine has an old Ford that uses a little oil, TCW3 in the gas has reduced his oil use.

How about those Amsoil filters for Toyota, cut the sevice interval by 10,000 miles, drop the price less than $2. STRONG.........Oh yea and they failed to deliver as promised. So much for testing the finished product.


As far as pulling oil off the shelf to test, Amsoil doesn't have to worry about SSO and ASM, no testing to fail, they aren't part of it.

AD

The GF is ready, I'm out of here.
quote:
Originally posted by ADFD1:


How about those Amsoil filters for Toyota, cut the sevice interval by 10,000 miles, drop the price less than $2. STRONG.........Oh yea and they failed to deliver as promised. So much for testing the finished product.
Not sure why you want to go off topic and talk about AMSOIL again.

How about them? It took years for Toyota to admit their engines were sludgers, pay claims and they reduced their oil and filter change intervals, upgraded oil requirements and to offer extended warranties. I don't see where the AMSOIL filters failed to deliver as promise. They offered to buy back and replace filters if the customers wanted. Their warranty covered any failure. AMSOIL is doing this as a precaution. I don't see where any of the AMSOIL filters failed due to the 25,000 mile 1 year interval design. If they did, there should be thousands of reports of them doing so. I don't see that. So I would say they did an excellent job of testing the finished product.
Last edited by timvipond
quote:
Originally posted by Trajan:
Tim says: "why don't the 2 cycle and auto manufacturers recommend it?"

By said logic, no one should be using amsoil as no car manufacturer recommends it.

I suspect that it amsoil had a TC-W3 rated oil, Tim would be telling us to use it. He'd have some amsoilcentric tests too.


No, the auto manufacturers recommend the API classification and SAE viscosity. Which AMSOIL and many other oils meet.

The auto manufacturers do not recommend 2 cycle oil.

AMSOIL does have a TC-W3 rated oil. http://www.amsoil.com/storefront/hpi.aspx?zo=1181889 . They and I do not recommend it for use in 4 cycle engines. Just like all the other 2 cycle oil companies and auto manufacturers.
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Tim Vipond:
How is Redline SI-1 cheaper than PI, when Redline recommends adding in every tank of gas, and PI is recommended every 4,000 miles. Redline is WAY more expensive.

------------------------------------------

Redline is to be used with every tankful for the benfit of adding much needed lube to todays 'dry' and damaging fuel,and to maintain consistant fuel injector spray patterns.

After all Tim,would you eat junk food for several months and then load up on health food for one day to fix the damage the junk food has done to your body. The smart money is on a consistant daily healthy diet as a means to stay healthy all the time.


Just a short duration of poor fuel economy can be costly,therefore....the redline might actually pay for itselt in the long run........by maintaining an ideal injector spray pattern,lubeing the fuel,and preventing drivabilty and fuel economy issues.

Prevention is the best maintenance! Dirty or clogged injectors can be impossible to clean once they get bad enough with conventional on car cleaning techniques.

This is what one should try to avoid because it's costly and sometimes the only alternative to new injectors.

OFF CAR INJECTOR CLEANING...

http://video.search.yahoo.com/...l+injection+cleaning
Last edited by captainkirk
quote:
Originally posted by Tim Vipond:
Why not use a product formulated specifically for your purpose such as https://www.amsoil.com/storefront/api.aspx?zo=1181889 ?


Why in the hell is this even mentioned? It is not a 2cycle oil.

Can we *ever* have a thread about oil without it turning into a sales pitch for amsoil?

I mean, c'mon... amsoil doesn't even make a TC-W3 rated oil.

Are amsoil sales that bad that some guy has to push the product in every thread.

And when I do use an injector cleaner, it's Gumout Regane. Which works well. And I can get it at Walmart for <$5.

Or, I could follow Tim logic and use Techron. Which, unlike PI, is recommended by an auto maker.

Go here and tell them. maybe you'll get a few bites Tim. http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/...=1573591&nt=7&page=1

You'll have a much wider audience there and in the LS1 forum thread.

But I suspect you'll get bit instead.

ps, None of the amsoil sellers there are pushing their product, yelling the sales mantra.
Last edited by trajan
I see this forum has been infected with the Vipond Virus also.
Tens of thousands of people have logged their results all over the internet utilizing TCW3. Vipond keeps asking me for a "report" and I keep telling him to go read all over the internet. He jabber talks to Shell (inferring to put the TCW3 into the crankcase) then post they do not recommend it. No I doubt they do Smile I doubt they would recommend putting it into gasoline for a 4stroke either Timmy Boy.....so what?
Vipond...if you do not wish to use TCW3 in your fuel then by all means do not. But to try and argue it is doing some kind of damage or is not providing results to the thousands of people who have positive results and have posted is just insane. Just keep trolling Amsoil on every forum (that you haven't been banned from yet).............Oh well....this guy does more damage to Amsoil than any Amsoil hater ever would.
quote:
Originally posted by Sarge:
Tens of thousands of people have logged their results all over the internet utilizing TCW3.
I've only seen some anonymous posters with anecdotes say it seems to work for them, some say it doesn't. So do placebos. So does a coin flip.
quote:
Originally posted by Sarge: Vipond keeps asking me for a "report" and I keep telling him to go read all over the internet.
You said "All I can say is we have documented well over 6 million miles in our volunteers automobiles since I began this experiment". I just asked to see your documentation and your experiment and you haven't provided either. If this miracle works like you think, I would think that all the two stroke companies, gasoline companies, and automobile manufacturers would recommend it. They don't.
Last edited by timvipond
quote:
Originally posted by Sarge:
I see this forum has been infected with the Vipond Virus also.
Tens of thousands of people have logged their results all over the internet utilizing TCW3. Vipond keeps asking me for a "report" and I keep telling him to go read all over the internet. He jabber talks to Shell (inferring to put the TCW3 into the crankcase) then post they do not recommend it. No I doubt they do Smile I doubt they would recommend putting it into gasoline for a 4stroke either Timmy Boy.....so what?
Vipond...if you do not wish to use TCW3 in your fuel then by all means do not. But to try and argue it is doing some kind of damage or is not providing results to the thousands of people who have positive results and have posted is just insane. Just keep trolling Amsoil on every forum (that you haven't been banned from yet).............Oh well....this guy does more damage to Amsoil than any Amsoil hater ever would.


Welcome back Sarge! TCW3 working well for me, and in the GF's Jeep. My beater idles better with it in the gas, to the point where I can tell when it isn't in the gas. I had similar observations with MMO but the TCW3 is cheaper!

While on leave for the Holidays I didn't bring any on my road trip. NOT GOOD SARGE! I started adding as soon as I got back to Bermerton and the idle is nice and smooth again. Sorry I didn't log mpg.

AD
Lord help us all.
Tim. For the eighteenth time. The "documentation" is the responses to my solicitation in my original thread on ls1.com.
Thousands of people have responded. Not only on ls1.com but many many many other forums as well.
Kerosene is used to clean parts all the time. Has been forever. But they do not recommend it for cleaning parts Timmy. So utilizing your rational nobody should use it to clean a car part.

Tell you what Timmy. You dont use it. Justify it in your mind because the manufacturer will not recommend it for a particular use or not. Do not use it because somebody did not pay off some "lab" to do some worthless 4ball wear test on it. Just keep spamming and trolling Amsoil until your banned from every site on the internet....then we all can be happy.
quote:
Originally posted by ADFD1:
quote:
Originally posted by Sarge:
I see this forum has been infected with the Vipond Virus also.
Tens of thousands of people have logged their results all over the internet utilizing TCW3. Vipond keeps asking me for a "report" and I keep telling him to go read all over the internet. He jabber talks to Shell (inferring to put the TCW3 into the crankcase) then post they do not recommend it. No I doubt they do Smile I doubt they would recommend putting it into gasoline for a 4stroke either Timmy Boy.....so what?
Vipond...if you do not wish to use TCW3 in your fuel then by all means do not. But to try and argue it is doing some kind of damage or is not providing results to the thousands of people who have positive results and have posted is just insane. Just keep trolling Amsoil on every forum (that you haven't been banned from yet).............Oh well....this guy does more damage to Amsoil than any Amsoil hater ever would.


Welcome back Sarge! TCW3 working well for me, and in the GF's Jeep. My beater idles better with it in the gas, to the point where I can tell when it isn't in the gas. I had similar observations with MMO but the TCW3 is cheaper!

While on leave for the Holidays I didn't bring any on my road trip. NOT GOOD SARGE! I started adding as soon as I got back to Bermerton and the idle is nice and smooth again. Sorry I didn't log mpg.

AD

Thanks man.....yeah many folks can tell the difference. I know I can in my hot rods and my old truck...well....it sorta is a hot rod also Smile
You know I did not come up with this. As I stated a few years ago when I first solicited folks input on using it....guys have been doing this for over 50 years. I was just curious and asked on a open forum. I never dreamed the responses nor it would go viral as it did. But I got my responses now didn't I Smile
Good to see your well............
Happy New Year to you sir! My dad and uncle have used it on and off for a long time too. My uncle swears his boat needs a UCL with the lousy ethanol gas. He gets better power adding either MMO or TCW3 to the gas. He thinks MMO cleans better, but for a tired engine TCW3 gets two thumbs up from him. He feels it makes for a better ring seal which could explain the bit more power he gets out of the old 250 I6 powered boat he has, and a smoother idle.

Not everything has to be spelled out on paper with a labs letterhead to work. Many successful products were born by accident. Even with supposed testing companies screw up then have to issue TSB's and redesign certain products because they fail in actual use. So where was the testing done? In actual use in some instances. So I take lab reports, testing, studies, corporate data, related to the oil industry the same way I see an advertisement. As paid for BS.

AD
A great many products have been discovered to have uses outside what it was originally designed for. (When the screws holding the arms on my glasses kept coming off, I used nail polish on them. And they stayed put.)

I remember back in the day of slowly pouring ATF into the carb while the engine was running. Cleaned things out.

The problem that I see here is the following. Using TC-W3 oil as a fuel add is money not being spent on an Amsoil product.

Demands are being made for "offical" documentation. Which is nonsense, as this is not marketed toward 4 cycle engines.

Many, many, people use this in their gas. I've been doing this for more than a year. I still have the original cat. I still have the original engine. I used Fuel Power in my 97 Camaro.

All of which had no ill effect.

Now I hate to break it to Tim, but no oil company in the world is going to endorse using fuel additives, unless of course it is one they make.

Now, a smart salesman/woman would say "Lots of people are using TC-W3 in their gas. There must be something to this. I better start telling my company they should get in on this."

A smart one would anyway.

Here's a question. Where is the documentation that says use of TC-W3 oil as a fuel additive will wreck the fuel system/engine/emissions.

This Amsoil uber alles is just so much claptrap when one consideres all the viable alternatives.
quote:
Originally posted by Trajan:



Now I hate to break it to Tim, but no oil company in the world is going to endorse using fuel additives, unless of course it is one they make.

Now, a smart salesman/woman would say "Lots of people are using TC-W3 in their gas. There must be something to this. I better start telling my company they should get in on this."

A smart one would anyway.



Here's what a smart salesman would say: People are using TCW3 added to gas with good results. Although it isn't mentioned on the label, and the company hasn't officially endorsed it, it works. Google it and see for yourself. If you think its something you'd like to try it? I can hook you up.

Simple, effective selling. It would be hard for TV now because he'd look like a fool to make an about face like that. His loss, or he'd be pushing TCW3 here, so its one less Amsoil product he's pushing here on us.

AD
quote:
Originally posted by ADFD1:
Do you have proof at 1 ounce/5 gallons of gas that it is killing catalytic converters? Have you gone to LS1.com and asked? 6,000,000 miles and counting.

AD


Catalytic converters and emission control systems are often warranted for 10 years. Do you have any proof that it will not harm catalytic converters and emission systems for 10 years? You guys seem to think it is safe and recommend it to others. Can you prove it? Will you pay if any damage occurs? Why take the chance if you can't prove it?
No need for me to prove anything Tim. My pop has been using a UCL in a Ford from the 80's still and has the original CC. My uncle does it as well, along with a lot of people they know. LS1 site has totaled according to Sarge's count over 6,000,000 miles. That is all the proof I need.

Go ask your question on the LS1 site, or were you banned from there? Better yet, search the www. and list all the cars ruined from a UCL.

Smart people do their homework, and base decisions on that. Are all the people on the LS1 board stupid? Are all the people using a UCL stupid? You don't think it works don't use it. Simple really.

Unlike you the users of the UCL products aren't ramming it down peoples throats, like you try and do with Amsoil.

AD
quote:
Originally posted by ADFD1:
No need for me to prove anything Tim. My pop has been using a UCL in a Ford from the 80's still and has the original CC. My uncle does it as well, along with a lot of people they know. LS1 site has totaled according to Sarge's count over 6,000,000 miles. That is all the proof I need.

Go ask your question on the LS1 site, or were you banned from there? Better yet, search the www. and list all the cars ruined from a UCL.

AD
I thought we were talking about TCW3 two stroke oil which was not formulated for, not tested in, not recommended by any manufacturer and not warranted for use in four stroke gasoline vehicles with catalytic converters. Not UCL that was formulated for and tested in gasoline engines. Why are you changing the subject? Again, why take the chance?
I know TCW3 two stroke oil works Tim, how's that? I'm taking the chance, and enjoying a better running beater as a result. People walking across the street take chances too, no big deal. Again, go to LS1 board, that's if you can and ask there. Preach to the guys who ran the 6,000,000 million miles and tell them. Link to this site so they can fully understand you. Sorry for grouping TCW3 into the UCL category, truth is that is what it's being used for over there, and what I'm taking about here. Besides IIRC you aren't a fan of MMO, or Lucas UCL either are you? Do you believe gas is perfectly formulated to be the very best for your engine?

AD
quote:
Originally posted by Tim Vipond:
So you cannot prove that TCW3 works and that it will not shorten the life of catalytic converters over the lifetime of the car and that it will not void the warranty. That is good enough for me.

Nope. And I cannot prove baby pigeons exist either. Never seen one.
I can and have requested peoples experience with utilizing a 2stroke oil in their gas in July 2008. Got lots of responses. Why don't you commission a study and provide us with the proof you need one way or the other. In the meantime thousands of folks will motor happily down the road with 1oz of TCW3 to 5 gallons of fuel....and have been for over 50 years.
You see....we (the TCW3 users) are testing and experimenting. You are selling. We will continue to test/report/share/debate and you can continue to sell.....or whatever it is you do.
Yes Sarge we are testing. Tim talks about testing, etc....... I wonder if Amsoil tested the EaO filters on Honda and Toyota applications for 6,000,000 miles to see if they'd fail. I don't think so, they failed and had to be redesigned. Seems the end user did the testing, without even knowing it. I wonder if they tested the 15,000 mile service life of the new and improved filter for 6,000,000 miles? At least here we're doing our own testing at our own expense, and taking "the risk".

AD
quote:
Originally posted by Sarge:
In the meantime thousands of folks will motor happily down the road with 1oz of TCW3 to 5 gallons of fuel....and have been for over 50 years.
You see....we (the TCW3 users) are testing and experimenting. You are selling. We will continue to test/report/share/debate and you can continue to sell.....or whatever it is you do.
So now you state as fact that TCW3 has been around for 50 years. I thought it was introduced around 1992. Care to share your reference?

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